X-T1 vs. iPhone

[Aswald]

I thought this is very interesting....my preference is obvious but what do you guys think?

 

http://www.theverge.com/2014/8/22/6055591/iphone-vs-pro-camera

 

 

[milandro]

It depends and comes down to what one is doing with photography.

 

These days, compared to when I was a kid, there are many more things photographed and filmed that ever before, this has to do with the fact that now not only almost everyone has a camera build in his phone.

 

Two examples when I was a 13 my father, uncle and I were on holiday and went fishing for conger eels at night. 

 

We got one which was particularly large,  so we went to town, woke up the village photographer and asked him to take a picture of us to document the event. My wife has hardly any pictures of her life from teens to when she met me because nobody had an interest in photography in her circles, so, at most, she has pictures at some particular event but very little else.

 

These days we all have images of everything that happens to us and to others easily recordable with a phone.

 

But they are two different media.

 

The phone-camera ( with few exceptions) is used to simply record events, the photographic camera is used to attempt to go at least one step further than simply recording events.

 

I am not saying that all people are ever reaching this and plenty shoot snapshots even with a pro camera. I am sure that the majority of people do realize that.

 

If you watch the dramatic images of the arrival of the refugees on the Greek shores, the first thi9ng they do is to shoot a picture of themselves and share it with their families, to tell them that they are safe.

 

Unfortunately, the sad events of the day show us also that in Paris , a great many of people involved in the sad and dramatic events, used their phones to document and show what was going on.

 

None of this ever happened before.

 

Times are A changing

[Naddan28]

Interesting article. Echoes my views, camera phones are fine for snaps etc but lack the control, specialism (through lenses) and IQ for serious images.

 

Although saying that I'm not sure the average joe can always appreciate these points. My dad for example has a iPhone pano printed on canvas (about 30"x12") above his stairs. He's happy with it, I can't abide it, composition aside, every step up the stairs and you get closer and spot more deficiencies in IQ.

[milandro]

Most people using a phone to shoot pictures ( and even many of those who use cameras) will never print most of what they shoot and only ever watch on their phone screens.

 

On other fora a seizable number of the people don’t even use computers anymore but it is all hand held devices. Within this context things look very different.

[jlmphotos]

Why are we discussing this?

[Aswald]

With smartphone and all, photographs does feel a lot less valuable. 

 

During the film era, you'd try to preserve that photograph the best that you can. Taking them out once in a while to look at and reminiscence.

 

Nowadays, people just store 'em in clouds. Sometimes I wonder if they ever flip through the 10 thousand or more snap shots they have.

 

In these context, I'd like to think of smartphones as picture machines and cameras as photographic machines.

[Aswald]

Having said that, under normal circumstances, the smartphone cameras does seem to be getting very close to say, an entry level dslr. I wonder if it would be right to say that in the short future, they may equal?

 

What more with Sony pushing sensor technology the way they are now.

[cug]

The problem with phones is control. Images from a phone look great on a phone, but when you look closer, it often falls apart quickly.

 

From the same spot at the same time, but different settings of course as I do have the control on the camera, but not as much on the phone:

 

[milandro]

that’s in fact why people use pictures shot on the phones or tablets to be viewed mostly on phones or tablets.

 

There is a definite impoverishing of how people are consuming images, that is also the reason why so many have taken to call themselves pro photographers while they are not.

 

I find that some customers have often lowered their expectations allowing some extremely mediocre people ( who ask a pittance for their "work “ ) in this once honorable and rewarding profession.

 

I may have told this story before.

 

A friend of mine who still has a studio (I closed mine 5 years ago) has serious problems to make ends meet, so he accepts to work for other photographic enterprises when he doesn’t have enough work for himself.

 

A mail order company with an on line shop with enormous amounts of items was looking for a photographer.

 

Their “photographer” was going on holiday so they sought a temporary replacement.

 

My friend went to speak with them and they told him that they were paying €200 per day and that he was to produce digital pictures ready to be used for their on line operation.

 

My friend asked how many pictures were they expecting him to produce every day, they answered 200.

 

My friend shook hands said his goodbyes and left the premises.

 

My first ever job conducted in my own studio in 1986 after I had been an assistant for many years and getting an advertising photography diploma, was shooting pictures for a catalogue of underwater photographic flashes and accessories. They paid me almost 30 years ago the customary fee of about €100 ( equivalent) per picture.

 

When I had my own studio I also worked for other photographers in the summer, for example, if there was not enough work and I wasn’t going on holiday. Since I was good in the darkroom and knew how to handle baryta paper a friend who worked as printer for a photographer asked me to dry paper for her. The photographer paid me €600 a month to work for him for two months ( in 1986 I could live quite comfortably with that king of cash)

 

Times are A changing.

 

Mal tempora currunt.

[Aswald]

Mala tempora currunt sed peiora parantur!

 

Well, globalization and fast communication speed seems to make our cash flow upwards....that is to the big corporations. I am not sure where the money goes to from there. Currency seems to disappear nowadays...

 

I'm going to retire in a small quiet town somewhere...and do slow photography.

[Aswald]

The problem with phones is control. Images from a phone look great on a phone, but when you look closer, it often falls apart quickly.

 

From the same spot at the same time, but different settings of course as I do have the control on the camera, but not as much on the phone:

 

 

I agree and see the same things. Lesser difference in good daylight shots but still a difference.

 

I wonder how much does the iPad generation care....

[milandro]

not much and not only the tablet or phone generation.

 

When I bought my first fuji X-E1 camera, speaking about it among fellow mature saxophone players, someone who was there would’t couldn’t understand why I would spend good money to buy a camera when he had one in his phone. 

 

I told him that I had been a photographer all my adult life and part of my adolescence and might have different requirements than his and he was nearly offended.

[Jürgen Heger]

@jlmphotos: People in general and old men in particular, like myself, like to complain that in old days everything was better

 

But to me it is more or less the discussion about how much camera do we need to take a good picture. I just read about Kathy Ryan and her new book "Office Romance" that was shot with an iPhone.

https://instagram.com/kathyryan1\?hl=de (I hope the link works. I had to type it as I do not know how to copy with my tablet)

 

Some in this forum insist that they get a higher resolution with the next Fuji generation, some are dreaming about medium format and others, like myself, absolutly need higher ISO and faster auto focus. But is anything necessary to create art? Obviously not. So this type of discusion can help us to get the feet back to the ground.

 

As much as I like to buy gadgets I know that I do not NEED them. It's just nice to have them. Not more.

[Aswald]

@jlmphotos: People in general and old men in particular, like myself, like to complain that in old days everything was better

 

But to me it is more or less the discussion about how much camera do we need to take a good picture. I just read about Kathy Ryan and her new book "Office Romance" that was shot with an iPhone.

https://instagram.com/kathyryan1\?hl=de (I hope the link works. I had to type it as I do not know how to copy with my tablet)

 

Some in this forum insist that they get a higher resolution with the next Fuji generation, some are dreaming about medium format and others, like myself, absolutly need higher ISO and faster auto focus. But is anything necessary to create art? Obviously not. So this type of discusion can help us to get the feet back to the ground.

 

As much as I like to buy gadgets I know that I do not NEED them. It's just nice to have them. Not more.

Nice link. Thanks for sharing. Kathy does have a very nice office! She certainly does have a great eye for composition.

 

Sometimes I think that GAS is more about searching for THAT camera than acquiring more cameras (if we ever will)....... as an example, I shot with the old Canon A1 for a decade and never looked for anything else. What I changed often were films. They made all the difference.

 

Then came digital. The 5D was and is still a great camera but the "film" built into that body is good till say iso1600?...before I knew it I was looking for a more sensitive "digital" film, a new camera.....the rest is history. 

 

Perhaps we haven't really reached digital photography maturity yet for us to stop our GAS.

[milandro]

I don’t think that before there were better photographers, jus a a lot less pictures taken

 

obviously the people on this forum prefer cameras to phones, otherwise they wouldn’t be here

[gordonrussell76]

There are two broad purposes to a camera to capture memories or to capture an arresting or artistically satisfying image. Some people are in one camp or the other some in both. If you are only after memories a record of an event of people special to you a Smartphone will do the job admirably. I think its for this reason the Small compact market has been hit so hard. I think that that market will pretty much disappear. You will have enthusiast and pro cameras only, the main differential between the two probably no longer about resolution or IQ but AF speed and how many card slots

 

The more and more that I pursue photography the more I realize that the most important skill a photographer has is self curation.

 

The ability to look at our work objectively and brutally remove anything that is not up to standard, as we develop this curation is honed and honed, I regularly remove pictures from my flickr stream that I no longer consider up to scratch. I am sure I am not there yet either and that many there today will not be there in a year. This is the antithesis of the memories photographer who will keep everything regardless of quality because each photo is a memory. I do that as well. I use facebook for my memories and I have a far less stringent curation process (although I am still fairly fussy) because its about sharing memories and experiences with my friends and family who are not geographically local to me. Flickr is my outlet for the stuff I want to put my name to.

 

It is an iterative process, and comes about but becoming aware of your own abilities and those of others and your personal 'bar' moving higher and higher. This sort of development is not new to me its the same with learning a musical instrument.

 

However all of these are endeavors, labours of love, passions something which gives a person joy in the process as much as the result. Otherwize why bother. For many there is no joy in this and that is fine they just want to snap and forget and that is totally cool. Everyone is different. I can't stand golf, but for many it is there favorite pastime.

 

The article at the top of this thread could just as well  be titled memories vs hobby as iphone vs X-T1

 

G

[Sir Duuk]

Funny thing,

Last june my wife and I spent a week in Rome.
(bought a 10-24 f4 and "desperately" needed to try it out at a suitable location , my wife totaly agreed.... )

I noticed the following.
The majority of pictures were taken with a phone.

(Not to mention those with their phones on a selfie-stick taking pictures (of themselfes) with the even worse frontcam of their devices)
I think that only 1 in every 300 people taking pictures used something like a genuine camera instead of a phone.
of those using a camera, I think 1 in 100 were using something else than a standard compact camera (DSLR, ILC etc.
I almost felt a little out of place with my humble X-E1 + 10-24.

 

People just want to have pictures (of themselfes), showing where they've been

I think gordonrussell76 sums it up pretty good
"The article at the top of this thread could just as well be titled memories vs hobby as iphone vs X-T1"

 

Ps,

Besides the ******* selfisticks everywhere, Rome is still a great place to go to every once in a while
 

[johant]

Cameras don't capture light...they freeze time. That's why light is measured in time.

Really? I would have to check, but AFAIK there is no time component in the definition of the Candela?

 

I think time only comes into the equation when you want to see how many photons are captured in a photoreceptor at the time of readout?

 

Edit: actually the number of photons is not read directly, of course, but the resulting electrical charge.

 

Edit2: the non-SI unit Lumen does have a time component, of course.

 

Edit3: of course this has much more to do with science than with photography.

 

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[gordonrussell76]

epscott

 

I agree memories can be art, I have a picture that I took of my daughter with my X-T1 that I have printed at A3 and it probably my favourite picture so far both technically and in content.

 

The point I was trying to make though its that there are 2 kinds of camera user (actually 3 if you include 'pros' but to be honest my definition of a pro is someone who is in catergory 2 but has got good enough at it that they earn their living from it).

 

1) Memory gatherer

2) Enthusiast/ Pro

 

I am not for a moment saying that category 2 photograhpers don't gather memories as well, we are all humans, I want to shoot my family my holidays, gigs I play with my band. We are just lucky because of our hobby we have cameras at our disposal that hopefully! make our pictures better. My point is though that category 1 memory gathereres find it hard to justify dropping £1000 on a camera or in fact even £200-300 on a small compact to take pictures they could achieve with there mobile device, something that they have already paid for and received utility from.

 

But I do agree memories can be art, and a good picture will always transcend the equipment used. However as a rule of thumb if I found myself in a situation where something I wanted to shoot happened I want to have a good camera in my hand, which is why i never leave the house without my X-T1 10-24/35 and 60mm in my bag. It the reason I went mirroless in the first place so I could have gear with me and not be overly encumbered.

 

G

 

G