Blur issue on X-T2 ?!

[daniel.k]

Hi guys,

I´m new to the forum and unfortunately I have to start here with a major problem with my - more or less - brand-new X-T2 (bought early October 2016). I´ve used a X-T1 before and was more than happy with it. However, only the best is good enough I decided to buy a X-T2. After some test shots I was quite impressed but did not use the new camera so much in the beginning (no time at all). I went to London a week ago and this was the first real-life test for my X-T2. Back home I was extremely disappointed: about 1/4 to 1/3 of all my photos were blurred!

So I set up a test series at home with different lenses, different settings at different times. Finally, after a few hundred pictures, I found that the problem remains with almost every lens I used. All these lenses are working pretty well on a number of other cameras (tested with X-T1, X-T10, X-M1). So it is obviously not a lens issue. Looks like my X-T2 has a serious problem.

I went to my local Fuji dealer this morning and was able to do a lot of test shots with another (brand-new) X-T2. I´ve used my own lenses and also some new lenses provided by the dealer. Result: almost the same! A lot of pictures are not really sharp!

However, it depends a lot on the settings... but otherwise not so much   Here is what I found (so far). The issue occurs:

- camera is used free-hand or on a tripod (no difference!)
- OIS is switched on or off, free-hand or tripod, all combinations mixed (no difference!)
- more likely with short focal length, but also noticable with longer focal lengths
- obviously only with shorter exposure times. I could not reproduce the problem with long exposure times!
- with most of my lenses (XF 18-55, XF 10-24, XC 16-50) but only rarely with the XF 55-200

- the problem is visible in JPG as well as in RAF

So finally it occurs in most real-life situations which makes the X-T2 more or less unreliable to me

The most confusing thing is that the brand-new X-T2 provided by my dealer this morning shows the same problems! So it is for sure not a problem of my lenses (they are working perfectly with other cameras) and it´s obviously not a problem of my(!) X-T2 only. At the moment it looks like it is a problem of the whole series... or at least of a (early?) sub-series.

It´s safe to say that it is not a problem of the camera settings (I used AF-S with priority on focus, single frame focus, fixed ISO and aperture values for all my tests and I did the test shots in a row, with only fractions of a second delay).
Totally frustrated I bought a X-T10 this morning to have a reliable camera for my next photo trip to Oman next week. When I´m back my X-T2 (maybe togehter with one or two of my lenses) will be sent to Fuji for inspection.
Tested all my lenses (under comparable circumstances today) with the new X-T10 and there are all pretty sharp. Without exception.
So... long story short:

Does anyone has similar problems with a X-T2 ????????

To make it more visible, here are some test shots. All JPG out-of-the-cam, 100% crop (!)

good one:
http://danielkaempf.com/pics/X-T2/XT2_10-24_OK01.jpg

blurred one from the same series, taken a second later:
http://danielkaempf.com/pics/X-T2/XT2_10-24_BLUR01.jpg

good one:
http://danielkaempf.com/pics/X-T2/XT2_10-24_OK02.jpg

blurred one from the same series, taken a second later:
http://danielkaempf.com/pics/X-T2/XT2_10-24_BLUR02.jpg

To me it does not look like a focus problem (because nothing at all is sharp in the blurred images) but more like a "shake" or OIS problem... although it also happens if OIS is turned off and the camera is used on a tripod.
Any ideas?
Same experiences?

I´m really confused and pretty disappointed by the X-T2 ...  and a little bit happy with my pin-sharp new X-T10 (which - of course - can not  be a real replacement and cost me another few hundred bucks   ).

 

 

UPDATE:

I just took another series of test pictures. All on manual focus. All(!) pictures are pin-sharp, even after 50 shots.

So it looks like there is an AF issue with the X-T2.....

 

Best regards,

Daniel
 

Edited November 5, 2016 by daniel.k

[voodooless]

This does not look like motion blur. Are you using AFS of AFC, what mode? What is the shutter priority set to? Is it also visible in the EVF/LCD? Try zooming in to the focus area using the rear command dial press. Does this look familiar: http://www.fuji-x-forum.com/topic/4285-camera-lies-about-focus/ ?

Edited November 5, 2016 by voodooless

[daniel.k]

I´m using AF-S for all my tests, as well as I´m using in everday´s life (I´m more into landsacpes than into action).

Shutter priority is set to Focus (!) and it is not really visibly in EVF/LCD. Only if I really zoom in deeply.... which I usually don´t after each shot

I found out some more details today:

- problem does NOT exist at all if I use manual focus, even if I took a series of 100+ pictures

- problem DOES exists also if I took close-up pictures from my computers screen (approax. 40-50cm distance)

- problem does NOT exist with all my lenses on my new X-T10

- problem DOES exist with another X-T2 I tried today with my local Fuji dealer

- according to a forum in my home country I´m not the only one having this problem (although these guys don´t really want to talk about it ... "holy cow"-issue

 

I just took a few close-ups with the X-T2 and the 18-55 from ym computer screen and I found the same issue. 75% are sharp, 25% are blurry.

 

FRUSTRATING!

 

Daniel

[voodooless]

Well, the german topic is actually very helpfull! Especially this post show exactly what I see In my topic.

 

I think this is a firmware issue and definitely not user or hardware related. Manual focus works flawlessly, so hardware in the lens is just fine. And user related? What user option would make the camera lie about having focus? That makes no sense at all.

[daniel.k]

ha....   you are aware of my German topic

cool anyway ...

 

Daniel

[kimcarsons]

I´m using AF-S for all my tests, as well as I´m using in everday´s life (I´m more into landsacpes than into action).

Shutter priority is set to Focus (!) and it is not really visibly in EVF/LCD. Only if I really zoom in deeply.... which I usually don´t after each shot

I found out some more details today:

- problem does NOT exist at all if I use manual focus, even if I took a series of 100+ pictures

- problem DOES exists also if I took close-up pictures from my computers screen (approax. 40-50cm distance)

- problem does NOT exist with all my lenses on my new X-T10

- problem DOES exist with another X-T2 I tried today with my local Fuji dealer

- according to a forum in my home country I´m not the only one having this problem (although these guys don´t really want to talk about it ... "holy cow"-issue

 

I just took a few close-ups with the X-T2 and the 18-55 from ym computer screen and I found the same issue. 75% are sharp, 25% are blurry.

 

FRUSTRATING!

 

Daniel

 

Have you determined if the frequency of occurrence of the out of focus shots is related to the aperture of setting of the lenses. i.e. does the problem happen more at f/8 than wide open?

 

I ask because, while I haven't experienced the exact problem you describe, I have noticed that the AF speed/behavior of the X-T2 varies with the aperture setting of the lenses, even though logically it shouldn't (because AF has always happened with the lenses wide open since AF was invented...)

Edited November 5, 2016 by kimcarsons

[BobJ]

I have ran some quick tests and I can't reproduce this effect on my X-T2, although I suppose it might show up in some special case.

[daniel.k]

Have you determined if the frequency of occurrence of the out of focus shots is related to the aperture of setting of the lenses. i.e. does the problem happen more at f/8 than wide open?

 

not yet, I did all my test shots with f/8.

However, I discovered the problem with real-life photos taken some days before my test series and there are also quite a few blurry ones taken with more open aperture.

 

Daniel

[voodooless]

I just did some more test with the 16-55 using various focal lengths and apertures and subject distances, but could not repoduce the results I had last week. What the difference is.. I don't know. I have seen a few complete AF fails, which are in itelf strange since the focus field was on a high contrast area. I also cannot say that I have as many unsharp images with the 16-55 as Daniel describes with his 18-55. So it is not that much of a bother (specially since I cannot reproduce it anymore).

 

A few more things to try:

- pre-AF on or off (I have it off)

- Boost mode (I have it on)

- DR modes (I tried auto and DR200)

- shutter AE/AF on or off (tried shutter AF off, but set it back now -> no difference)

- AF Illuminator (don't think that does much, but who knows.. set it to off now)

- do you have face detection set to auto? That should impact AF performance negatively (in fact, any mode other than off should).

- check that shutter priority on AF-S is set to focus

[cosinaphile]

 thats unfortunate ... i hope this is isolated and affected machines can be remedied with firmware

 

fuji is excellent with addressing problems are they rear their ugly head.... good luck with fixing these issues 

Edited November 11, 2016 by cosinaphile

[Adam Woodhouse]

Very odd.  I have shot 4 weddings with my XT2 and some high school football.  Images are razer sharp when I nail focus and don't have camera shake.  I have found in going from XT1 to XT2 (as I found the same when I went from 12mp Nikon to 24mp Nikon) that it is much easier to have a slightly soft image due to camera shake because the greater pixel density of the same size sensor will be less forgiving with camera shake at same focal lengths.  This was a common problem people that jumped on the Nikon D800 band-wagon when it first came out.  Many didn't do their homework and learned (for some a costly lesson) that they can't hand hold that camera at the lower shutter speeds like they use to on their previous lower MP cameras.  Nikon's public response was "the new D800 forces you to be a better photographer".  LOL   There was a ton of buzz about it because so many people noticed it.  The new Canon 50mp have addressed this in their hardware/software.  The greater the pix density, the more noticeable camera shake (even when it is very little) appears.

 

I'm not saying that is the cause (particularly if manual focus works perfect every time and AF does not) ... I'm saying I've seen something similar at another time and that was the cause back then.

Edited November 11, 2016 by Adam Woodhouse

[voodooless]

Nope, at least in my case it is/was definitely no camera shake. Focus was clearly off, even visible in the EVF before taking any photo.

[Dani Zisserman]

Could this be related to Camera vs. Lens compatibility issues? Not that such should occur, but from reading the German thread, it seems that the problem occurs with certain lenses and doesn't occur with others...

 

Personally I've had a similar experience with my XF60, but on completely different cameras...

On the XE-1 it focused slowly, but quite accurately...

On the XT-10, however, it focuses much quicker, but displays the same AF miss phenomenon as described here, which brings to do do an AF+MF confirmation every time...

 

I have never experienced similar problems with XF35 or XF55-200, or even XC16-50.

 

It might be that the motor in the affected lenses is not fast enough to keep up with the increased AF speed of the camera itself...

[voodooless]

Had it again yesterday with the 16-55, fully zommed in. Only a few times though. If it is a problem with lens speed the 16-55 should not be affected, since it is one of the fastest lenses. And I don't think it is because refocusing should then fix the issue. And in most cases if it's bad once it will remain bad.

Edited November 13, 2016 by voodooless

[Rand47]

Are you using AF + MF by any chance?

 

Rand

[voodooless]

Yes, AF+MF is enabled, but I'm sure that in the instances that I had problems, I did not touch the MF.

[voodooless]

Last couple of days again problems with the 16-55. I had it fail focus completely a few times. Today on such an occasion I tried the MF wheel, and after that focus worked again. I guess I'll try disabling AF+MF for now and see if it helps.

[daniel.k]

Last couple of days again problems with the 16-55. I had it fail focus completely a few times. Today on such an occasion I tried the MF wheel, and after that focus worked again. I guess I'll try disabling AF+MF for now and see if it helps.

 

if you enabled AF+MF you can change the focus accidentally by turning the focus ring of the lens slightly. This of course will de-focus the picture.

 

Daniel

[voodooless]

if you enabled AF+MF you can change the focus accidentally by turning the focus ring of the lens slightly. This of course will de-focus the picture.

 

Obviously.. I'm pretty sure that that is not what is happening here though.

[steviewonder]

When I moved from the Nikon D7000 to the D800 that was exactly my experience; minimum shutter speed had to be increased and only the best glass would do b/c the D800 shows all flaws. On the other hand, boy can you crop those files.

 

quote name="Adam Woodhouse" post="37636" timestamp="1478894309"]Very odd.  I have shot 4 weddings with my XT2 and some high school football.  Images are razer sharp when I nail focus and don't have camera shake.  I have found in going from XT1 to XT2 (as I found the same when I went from 12mp Nikon to 24mp Nikon) that it is much easier to have a slightly soft image due to camera shake because the greater pixel density of the same size sensor will be less forgiving with camera shake at same focal lengths.  This was a common problem people that jumped on the Nikon D800 band-wagon when it first came out.  Many didn't do their homework and learned (for some a costly lesson) that they can't hand hold that camera at the lower shutter speeds like they use to on their previous lower MP cameras.  Nikon's public response was "the new D800 forces you to be a better photographer".  LOL   There was a ton of buzz about it because so many people noticed it.  The new Canon 50mp have addressed this in their hardware/software.  The greater the pix density, the more noticeable camera shake (even when it is very little) appears.

 

I'm not saying that is the cause (particularly if manual focus works perfect every time and AF does not) ... I'm saying I've seen something similar at another time and that was the cause back then.

[voodooless]

When I moved from the Nikon D7000 to the D800 that was exactly my experience; minimum shutter speed had to be increased and only the best glass would do b/c the D800 shows all flaws. On the other hand, boy can you crop those files.

 

No, that is not at all what is going on. You can actually see the AF fail in the EVF already in most cases: it's just that far off. Over on the German forum, several people appear to have the same experience, mainly with one of the zooms.

 

Anyway, apparently the new firmware does improve things according to several people. I did not have a change myself to do the test. I hope they fixed it though.

[XFuji16]

I did a studio shoot yesterday and was shocked at how out of focus nearly the images were. I haven't started testing yet, but I can't think of a single good excuse why this should have happened. I'll test a bit but will be contacting Fuji if things are at all problematic. Anyone have any experience with Fuji repair?

[voodooless]

What lens did you use? I think the firmware update did improve things to the point where the unsharpness is jot visible anymore in the viewfinder, but still apparent in the end. Also I think I have less sharp images now... Last time 4 out of 5 images were blurred with 16-55. It's most apparent on the long end of the lens.

 

I hope to have some more time next week to do some controlled tests and also with the X-E2. I might then decide to send the lens in for repair.. Can't imagine that the body is the problem.

[spivey]

Very strange. Perhaps this problem is lens-related? I've just made several test shots with my X-T2 and the 35/1.4 -- all of them are perfectly sharp.

 

Daniel.K -- please let us know what happens.