x-tc

How about posting two photos at the same FL and exposure settings. same DR mode, same film simulation, shadow, highlight tone and sharpening offsets. Both raw and JPEG.

the same people who say film is better than digital and records are better than CDs? For those people, I bet they think Fuji is doomed, they will NEVER be able to reproduce the colors of the X-Pro1 on any future X-T camera... Doomed I tell you. Just file for bankruptcy now Fuji, you lost your colors when you killed off the x-pro1 and for that you are on a death spiral of doom. You have lost your mojo.

Hard to tell, I have not seen what he can do. I give him the benefit of the doubt until I see something. If he believes his claim, which I believe he honestly does, then I'd like to see him publish something to prove it using a photo or two as an example. I think it would be quite eye opening to the X-trans community as a whole and educational. It would certainly give pause to all of the LR naysayers and put the debate to rest.

of course. You make complete sense to me. Very practical especially when there is no sacrifice in image quality compared to the primes.

Its a wide angle lens. Corners matter, its not a portrait lens. ...and again... lets stick to what the OP task is here. A vacation. No one has questioned the IQ of the zooms against the primes for that task. Anyone?? anyone? raise your hand. If you want to say the OP will likely shot action in low light or needs shallow DoF on vacation photos, make that point and prove it. Otherwise, you are going in circles with the whole, you only need a fixed FL debate. A zoom offers you a range of fixed FL.. take your pick and don't move the zoom dial if you are so inclined to force yourself to a fixed FL based on creative choice.

The 10-24 is pretty close to the 14 prime. I think for a wide however, corners are quite important compared to center. The 10-24 is better than the 18 prime. The 18-55 is better than the 10-24 at 23. Neither as as good as the 23 prime. 18-55 is really close to the 35 prime. Don't know about 10-24 vs 18-55 at 18. Considering both zooms are better than the 18mm prime at 18, I am not sure it matters. like I said for my vacation, I'm packing an 10-24 on one camera and 18-55 on the other. There is opportunity for both cameras to be shooting at the "normal" side. That is not a bad thing as it means both camera can be shooting normal most of the time with the option to either go wider or longer for "what if" situations. Depending on which one you are holding. Fuji makes amazing zooms.. not something that I am used to with other brands. Certainly not any that compete with primes. Something to be said for that. Now if you want to be shooting action in low light or shallow DoF on your vacation, then its no contest. Neither of which, I am going to do on my vacation for sure. YMMV. The primes have an edge for those tasks. For all else the versatility of the zooms is hard to beat and with Fuji, pretty much on par with prime IQ.

I think olli nailed this point in post in #13. "Do you really want to limit your options on a major trip for the sake of 200 grams?" * actually olli is being conservative here. its less than that if you want to get technical. 170g. btw, olli here is the weight of a water in the bottle. The bottle adds extra weight. ;-) 1 fluid oz = 28.35g. 16.9oz x 28.35g/oz = 479.115g / 454g/lb = 1.06lbs of water. so 6 oz. without the bottle.

sorry.. I got confused when you started talking about "what if" shots not being a good way to think and then to prove your point you compared one fixed FL lens to another fixed FL lens without comparing the two lens the OP was asking about; which was a fixed FL 14 vs a 10-24 FL zoom for the "what if" scenario.

What is the topic of this thread again?? oh yeah.. there it is. 14 vs 10-24 for vacation shots.

mbb101, understood. Yes, it look pretty good. Much better than what I got from LR. The JPEG output from PN still may be to blame for some of moire still and other issues I mentioned in the shadows. I'd like to see the TIFF if you are inclined to upload it someplace. I did two outputs in C1P 8.2, one for JPEG and one to TIFF. I could still make out the moire in the JPEG output on the shirt but not the face. I don't detect any moire in the TIFF or on-screen in C1P. weird. Maybe you can find some that I can't find in the TIFF. Below is the TIFF output if you want to do a comparison for yourself from C1P 8.2 vs PN. My settings: Moire 80. Exposure EV -0.2, Highlight recovery at 80 for the hat. Slight Shadows rescue at 8. Slight sharpness with Clarity Structure set at 10, I guess I could set it to 0, I don't see much difference. I didn't want to over sharpen. Just a touch to make out the lint and weaving pattern on the bottom center portion of his shirt at 400%. ;-) Amazing detail for 16MP. Awesome job Fuji. You can download the TIFF from here is you are interested; its 75MB after cropping: https://www.dropbox.com/s/96cnaie4q3h8pim/DSCF9038.tif?dl=0 Hope you find it useful.

I don't think Fuji makes a "bad" lens. For $100 net for 16-55 vs $300 for the XF 18-55 with the X-T10 kit. Its a good value if you want to get started and is "above average" compared to other kit lens from Nikon and Canon IMHO. In contrast, the 18-55 is probably the best kit lens you can buy from any camera manufacturer. Fuji, Nikon, Canon, Panasonic, Samsung, Olympus. The XF 18-55 is the king of kit standard zooms. Fuji has set the bar with the 18-55, its really up to you what is good enough for you and what kind of quality you are expecting for $100 vs $300. At $100, its not a great loss if you decide its not good enough later on. Also with the plastic mount, I would not expect it to last forever. All of my plastic mount lens have either broke at the mount or have misaligned elements. Anyhow, at $100, its no big loss. So if it breaks in a few years, you can decide to upgrade if you want. I guess it depends how much you intend to use it and how often. If you intend to shot a lot, are picky about performance at the extreme ends, and do not intend to buy any more lens for a long while and just want a "do it all lens" that you will be thrilled with, stay on the camera 100% of the time, and not have any doubts shooting wide open in the corners, then I personally would invest the extra $200 for 18-55 up front. If budget is tight and you are not critical about the corners and do not expect heavy usage the XC 16-55 will be good lens. Better than what is offered from Nikon and Canon in cropped format certainly IMHO. That said, I left Nikon DX lineup because I got fed up with poor quality DX "kit" lens (handling, durability, and soft shots wide open, especially or at the long end) and was thrilled to have the option to buy the amazing XF18-55. Some people say the XF18-55 is one of the reason to buy into the Fuji X series interchange cameras in the first place. That is how good it is. This might help you familiarize yourself with the 16-55 relative to the 18-55. Again at $100, its a no brainer if you are just getting into the brand and want to get going. If you want to look ahead more long term, you can't get much better than the 18-55. http://admiringlight.com/blog/review-fujifilm-fujinon-xc-16-50mm-f3-5-5-6-ois/2/ Although I don't find a review comparing 16-55 to 18-55 directly, here is a review of the XF18-55 vs the XF35mm prime lens to give you a sense of how good a zoom can be when it is compared to a prime. Maybe this may help explain why some people buy into Fuji X camera just for the XF18-55. http://www.fujivsfuji.com/18-55mm-vs-35mm-f1pt4/

The fact that it came back from an unrelated issue, frankly makes me worry even more. They may have mishandled the circuit board. Many HW glitches are power related. Try to see if High Performance mode (no Power Management) or a different battery makes any difference. I'm curious if that will fix it without raising to much hell over there. Might be worth a try. I'd still make them look at it again, especially if the problem started after they touched it during the last service.

Fuji service told you this? This would not be acceptable to me. Reset would lose all your custom settings. I would ask for supervisor and not take no for an answer until they fix it or replace your camera. Keep knocking on different doors (take good records, names and dates) or ask who the head of the service department is and send a certified letter to that person if you are prepared to wait. People hate paper trails. As much as they just want for you to go away along with your problem, they hate having a paper trail hanging over their head with their name attached to it even more. btw, I'm hoping that you may not have to do a reset in SW until this problem is resolved. Pop the battery out, turn on the camera to drain the capacitors. Then replace battery. If its a HW glitch, this would effectively cause the reset signal to be sent to all HW components when power is returned. Turning camera on and off with battery installed may not be sending the HW reset signal and may be keeping some of the system in low power sleep mode to help it come back "on" faster.

...must resist making a joke here... must resist.

Guest_H Routt_*, please create an account so I can "like" your post.

I felt the same way. Every dog has its day.

regarding body styles, I had the same experience with the other Fuji. Fuji Heavy Industries. Commonly known as Subaru. I love the regular Legacy wagon body style and manual transmission. However, they have decided it was a better business decisions to only sell Outbacks (raised body) and CVT in North America. I jumped and complained along with other enthusiasts and you know what? Fuji in the end made the right decision, they are raking in the money now. The enthusiasts don't matter when the masses speak and the bean counters look at the return on investment and profit margins. I am afraid we have the same thing here with rangefinder vs SLR style bodies. I could be wrong, but judging by the discounting of X-E2 vs X-T1, I think I am not. If X-E3 comes out, I will be pleasantly surprised. I just don't know what else they could offer besides the changed EVF position to make it worth while without confusing the masses. Especially now that Sony markets rangefinder body as entry/mid grade and SLR body as high end. Stupid confused consumers? maybe. Even though SLR style for mirrorless camera does not really make sense from a practical point of view ( just like a jacked up Legacy wagon ), it does seem to sell and attract former SLR owners more than rangefinders. In the end that is all that matters from a profit point of view.

I am sure the Sony cropped sensor customers are saying the same thing. But its not gonna happen. If you want high quality glass with EVF your only choice in the competition today is FF SLR style bodies or m43 SLR bodies. Its may be a gamble, but where else are rangefinder style existing customers going to go? To the competition? yet, people are going to complain and jump up and down.. but Fuji really does not need to do anything. Nor does Sony, or Canon or Nikon, or Olympus, or Panasonic, or Samsung or Pentax. There are no other options once existing rangefinder still cameras get stale. Meanwhile they are raking in the money with the X-T style body which obviously is working for them and is NOT getting discounted by any significant amount. Unlike X-E2. -$100 in ~1.5 years on X-T1? wow. Cha ching... run with it Fuji.

that is understandable. I don't think Fuji wants to compete in the Sony space. Its low margin stuff and Sony has an advantage there. Sony will eat them alive when it comes to price and video. This is why I think Fuji is going after the higher end competitor; Olympus. They got the lens, which Sony does not and for the looks of things has no intention to do so in cropped sensor space. Same be said for Nikon and Canon. I think Fuji had to make a choice. Since they are a relatively small business unit, and can not sustain two different bodies styles with similar features, who would they likely loss sales to if they make Rangefinder vs SLR. Sony Rangefinder or Olympus DLSR? I think they made the right choice from a business model point of view. They are drawing DSLR users who want smaller quality lens that can only be found on either FF cameras or m43. In these two markets, its all DSLR style bodies. They have tried it both ways. Rangerinder and SLR style. Sounds like by the numbers and that fact that they are selling a 1.25 yr old camera at only $100 discount, they have made a choice.

perhaps you would be happier with the Sony A6xxx. Why wait? The A6000 already has more features and MP than the X-E series and in a lighter, less expensive and rangefinder style package. Sony seem to indicating that they will stick with rangefinder design for the cropped sensor entry and mid-grade stuff. SLR style for the high end FF. I think Fuji had to pick to go after A6000 or OM-D E-M10 for the entry and mid-grade stuff. Looks like they chose to go after Olympus instead of Sony. I don't they Fuji is large enough to put out two different cameras which differ just in body style. Anyhow, I think they have a better chance as winning over the Olympus customer than Sony. Olympus has good glass, good JPEGs, poor video.

please elaborate on what constitutes an "expert" lens in your mind. Do you mean, its a lens that is intended for a specific kind of use where as the zoom is more versatile?

I agree. For our vacation to Europe the wife and I will be packing two X cameras. One with XF10-24 the other with XF18-55. I'll probably pack a pair of XF27 (which weight nothing) in case times call for something a bit more inconspicuous in densely populated areas.

ouch.

People in Fender forums put their stuff in display cabinets? Or is that reserved for the Gibson Les Paul crowd?

ah got it.. confused me there. My post was about trying to understand why the firmware on X-T10 would allow reprogrammable buttons but hold back that same change on upcoming X-T1 firmware.