gordonrussell76

Can I get a shout out

See end of this topic I beat you to it http://www.fuji-x-forum.com/topic/472-fujifilm-x-t2-coming-pretty-soon-after-the-fujfilm-x-pro2-source-right-in-the-past/

So I was right

I just saw this over at Alpha Rumors, and its a worrying rumor because I have a feeling that Sony might be playing silly whotsits (see below) I have never really got to the bottom of whether the X-Trans has sony kit at its heart or not (never really cared as I am buying an overall package) however if there is or if the new 24MP sensor in the X-Pro 2 is using Sony tech under license then it makes me wander if the below might mean a delay (deliberate or otherwize) to the X-Pro 2. The dates line up Sorry this is not a new post but I guess I am not important enough member of the forum as I don't seem to be able to open new threads (or it could be the terribly out of date browser at work) So i shoe horned it into this thread as if its true then both the X-Pro2 and X-T2 could be delayed. It even makes me wander if the reason they will release them together is because of the delay and this might explain why X-E2 is suddenly getting V4 of the firmware. http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/ 'I now got info from Ricoh and Nikon sources: They told us that Sony developed a new sensor for the A7000. By contract that sensor could be used by other companies six months after the Sony A7000 announcement. The delay of the A7000 release also changed their product roadmap. To use the new Sony APS-C sensor with hybrid autofocus tech they will have to release their camera sometimes in 2016 instead of late 2015. Let’ hope Sony will announce the A7000 during the next announcement session in September/October!'

I do find it all hilarious, I was a M43 user and I loved that system and am still thinking of getting a G5 and a couple of lens for video stuff given that the Fuji stuff is currently horrendous for video. Waiting on the X-Pro2 to see if they sort it out and then will make a decision then. I get that cameras are a nice thing. I love the way my fuji looks and I do get a thril when I 'fondle' it. I think we can form emotional bonds with items like that. For me though that emotional bond is not something that makes me purchase an item. Its something that happens from using it. I bought my X-E2 because it had the best blend of features. I have subsequently come to love it, because it has taken some wonderful pictures and has come with me on some wonderful journeys, for e.g recently to DisneyLand europe with my daughter. There is not a single picture from that trip that I consider worthy for anyone outside of my family to look at (okay maybe 1), however it did capture a lot of wonderful memories faithfully and so it has become part of my life in a way that a kettle just does'nt So I think its okay to fondle your camera, as long as you also take amazing photo's with it as well. Is it the single justification for a system no, but just because you love your camera, does not automatically make you a bad photographer, it just makes you human. I like the guitar comparison. My main instrument is bass. At the moment I have a £1600 Warwick 5 string bass, that is amazing and does a lot of things really really well, its great for smooth stuff soul, latin, hip hop etc and I also have a £200 Squier Jaguar 4 string, that is cheap as chips totally stock and sounds and play wonderfully and can do some really nice punky growl but also slaps and pops in a very funky seventies kinda way. Both have a place in my playing, I value both equally even though one cost 8 times more than the other. Bottom line here think like an artist not a technician. I come across this all the time in music. Yes you do have to be technical, but the key is to internalize the technicque so that it becomes muscle memory something that you don't really think of its just there to be drawn upon to realize your ideas. Technique is a means to an end. When it becomes the end you have a problem.

6 months that makes total sense. That would be around the time the X-Pro 2 is launched so the X-E2 gets new life and will still fit in with the overall regime whilst not impacting initlal sales of X-T10. Ie If you want a rangefinder and you can't afford an X-Pro 2 you can get a X-E2 you lose out on 24MP and 4k but a lot of purists won't care. In fact a lot of people might keep an X-E2 as a second body certainly initially in case the X-Pro2 low light performance suffers due to the increased pixel density. The X-Pro2 sales won't suffer because it will still be latest and greatest. Fuji will get major PR from review sites and users because they are updating a 2 year old camera, encouraging people considering buying any of their cameras that its a good investment. They will benefit from people like me content to wait and who will now invest more in glass. Then they can release X-T2 6-9 months after X-Pro2 with the 24MP, Dual Flagships The really interesting question is what they will release next after that an X-T20 or an X-E3 I imagine they will review sales figures of both cameras and decide based on that. G

That would be awesome if it was brought upto X-T10 spec In a way I wander whether imminent release of Sony A6100 might have impact. Ie its rangefinder and A6000 has been very successful competitor for X-E2 already. Maybe they figured if they are not releasing an X-E3 soon that it makes sense to keep the eixsting body in that style competitive. Before anyone jumps down my throat, I would rather have an X-E2 in its current form than an A6000 I just prefer the Fuji colours and rendering and theri lens, and the fact that I can customize with hand grip etc etc I have to be honest the features I am most looking forward to are. 1) EV dial working in manual and AUTO-IS0 Manual mode. 2) New AF would be awesome mainly for enhanced low light. If they give it the full fat I suspect that the X-E2 might be better in continous mode than X-T10 as I read it has a better buffer? 3) Custom Q menu, I shoot RAW and currently the only thing I change in the Q menu is Film Simluation and occasionally DR it would be really nice to be able to cut it down to just the stuff I need and maybe add in some of the focus options etc. Electronic shutter I can live without although its sounds very interesting for me it more of a specilized situation thing whereas the above would be useful ALL the time. Manual Video - I would love this, but can live without. Interesting aside. Until I heard rumour about X-Pro2 having 4k video etc, I thought that one way Fuji might differentiate between the Rangefinder and SLR range was video. Historically most hybrid cameras have been SLR in design (Canon 5d/Lumic GH1/Sony A7s etc) the exception to that rule is the A6000 and LX100 both very capable video cameras. I thought that Fuji might follow suit and keep video the preserve of the X-T range and focus the X-Pro on stills, which makes a lot of sense to me still actually given the general demographics. Ironically I am the outlier there and personally am stoked the X-Pro2 is getting video

The guts of hte X-E2 is the same as the X-T1 so the AF totally could be improved. I also wander about all these people saying the EVF on teh X-E2 is worse when comparing in a camera store. I doubt the stores are religious about updating the firmware. The X-E2 EVF lag was improved in one of its existing firmware releases so its very possibel that people are comparing an early firmware X-E2 not one with the latest which would give a dodgy result. Finally psychosomatically the X-T10 is newere and shinier, I think that may have a sway. Also I wander if Fuji have learnt there lesson and the X-T10 ships with performance enhance mode switched on in default. So many people write off the X-E2 (and X-T1) at the beginning because they had power saving on, which does the AF speed no favours. G G

Perhaps although I have always found that when it comes to creativity, the best material whether music or image often comes from working around the limitations whether they are in ability or in the equipment used. So perhaps your right, maybe the X-E2 is just perfect as it is. Certainly that Time cover taken recently with an X-E2 won't benefit from Zone AF

The big guys yeah When I was in a band we often would do an encore that was unplanned, normally it would be a song that we were 90% there on, but did not feel was strong enough yet to play out. If we were getting a good reaction and an encore it woudl often be a great time to debut it as we had an appreciative audience (encores are usually not requested at the end of a bad gig) and the adrenaline rush would usually carry us through any of the sections we were still a bit ropey on. I have played planned encores before ie songs we had held back from set in case we got an encore, and do you know I swear audience can tell when your flying by the seat of your pants becuase whenever we did an unplannned one it always used to go down way better, its like they picked up on our nerves and kinda liked that we were taking a risk and felt part of it. So I have no idea if any of that is in any way relevant to this probably not, but to draw a tenous link, a planned encore is a studio set up shot, the unplanned one is a definitive moment

Well count me in the i am not sure camp Some of you will be unsurprised to hear me say that the X-E2 is my favorite body. I think its the nicest looking out of hte X-Pro X-T1 X-T10 and X-E2 so if they brought out an X-E3 I would be all over it. I have to say i like the addiiton of a front control wheel on the X-T10/1 so an X-E3 with that on that could be customized to ISO would be AWESOME, and if they threw an articulating screen on there I would be in 7th heaven. ANyway back in the real world. I really prefer EVF over OVF, and the X-T2 will almost certainly have better EVF. HOwever you can just choose not to use OVF on the X-Pro and its nice to have it for action so that plus my preference for rangefinder form factor put me down for X-Pro 2 in this contest.

Sorry about the Fuji losers spelling error, that was combination of auto spell check and fat fingers, now you see why ergonomics are so importment to me

ps to give balance to all this I took about 12 shots today on the way in to work, I think 2 maybe 3 are keepers or of interest. The fact remains update or not its a very capable camera that I will get many more years of pleasure from. G

I don't think any of us think that the X-E2 owners deserve and update. But market forces will out as you say, perhaps the few of us on here are not in the grand scheme of things worth retaining as customers that is up to Fuji. WHat I will say here though if I was a new customer standing holding an X-E2 and an X-T10 in a shop and the specs were the same I would buy the X-E2. I know this becuase when I bought my X-E2 the X-T1 had just come out. I stood in a shop holding both in my hands. Now you might be thinking this a cost issue. No, I sadly had all my camera gear stolen tail end of last year and thank god the insurance company paid out. So I went into the shop to buy and X-T1 as I had researched a few articles and decided on Fuji, and from what I had read the X-T1 was the nuts. I also looked at X-E2 as they had one, and I went away very confused, as I prefered the X-E2 the 'lesser' camera. In felt better ergonomically in my hand, I prefered the D-Pad I actually felt that the doors on it were of a better build quality particularly the one covering the USB/Mic/Hdmi sockets and despite the fact that the X-T1 has an ISO dial and a tilty screen both features that I rather liked. Ultimately I went with my gut and got the X-E2 a decision that I have been very very happy with. I love that camera, I love the form I love the ergonomics I love how the controls just fall under my fingers. So am I an outlier, or are they a lot of others like me that prefer the X-E line who knows market forces will speak. However we will never have a true reflection on this while the X-E2 is lower spec'd than the X-T10 (I actually agreed that he X-T1 shoudl have better features it is theoretically top of its line) but until that occurs you are probably right a lot of people will probably plump for the X-T10. Hell there are some who will go for it instead of the X-T1 just becuase its newer and shinier, some will buy the X-t10 becuase it come in silver not platinum and what they really want is an Olympus OMD Em5 with an APS sensor. Bottom line is, I really don't think that giving X-E2 users the firmware is going to harm sales of the X-T10 significantly but it might keep a lot of customers loyal and result in extra glass sales, keeping people in the system. Surely that is positive for all Fuji losers. If forced to choose between X-E and X-T a % will choose another brand. Again unless anyone happens to have sales figures for X-E line they we are all, myself included just p'ing in the wind. I guess lets just wait and see what will be. But you can't blame us for being excited

Don't forget Classic Chrome, I have seen some very annoyed X-Pro1 users on that subject Now you're just taking the Michael I do agree, as much as I love the X-E2 form factor as a range finder I would love a tilting screen, but that really is upgrade to X-E3 time I would love a tilt and rotate screen while we are blue skying here. I know that there is a perception that its only for videographers and selfie-harmers but I really miss it from my last camera, in fact its the only thing which the X-E2 does not do better. Maybe they will put one on the X-Pro 2 as its going to have 4k video, it would make a degree of sense. Although having observed Fuji incremental gain policies my money would be that X-Pro 2 and X-E3 have tilting screens and the X-T2 will have the full monty rotating tilt screen Still I can start dreaming now of the X-Pro 3 with full rotating screen 8k Video and medium format

Its not about old or new, its about current. The X-E2 could be 10 years old, but until they release a X-E3 its technically the most current camera in its line. I guess thats the point I was trying to make above distilled into a more succinct post

Just for reference was pootling about on the interwebs and found this quote from the original Phoblographers review of the X-E2, I found it interesting because a) it echoes my feelings on it being the strongest blend of features in the Fuji Range (totally subjective, but there you go) and the buyers remorse reference. At the time I bought the X-E2 everyone was in full on Fuji love fest for their Kaizon programme, all there cameras were getting update love and it did inform my purchasing decision. I think that is another reason why the X-E2 probably deserves one more go round the firmware merrygoround, I know that there was no cast iron contract, nor should you buy a camera (or anything) with expectation of updates, but it did seem a fair bet. Final and most interesting thought i have just had about all this, is what is the X-E2 update going to contain if it gets one. Becuase they already branched it to differentiate from the X-T1 ie it has no Manual Video mode. Are we going to get a version that only introfuces AF improvement but leaves it crippled as a Video camera, or will they give it the full fat update bringing it up to speed with the X_t1 and T10 “The Fujifilm X-E2 occupies a midway point between the entry-level X-A1 and the professional-grade X-Pro 1. The main difference between the X-Pro 1 and the X-E2 is that the latter only has an electronic viewfinder. The X-Pro 1 has a hybrid OVF/EVF, which is one of its most praised features. I find that the X-E2 is easier to work with, and that it produces images that are just as beautiful, if not more so. What sets Fujifilm apart from most companies is its commitment to its customers. Buyer’s remorse doesn’t really exist with Fujifilm’s X series because it continues to release firmware updates that will improve your camera’s performance.”

Milandro your right Fuji can't keep updating old models. But the X-E2 is not an old model. Its older than the X-T1 and 10 but I think that is an unfair comparison. It is the newest ILC rangefinder style camera in the line up and therefore I believe it should be kept current until the X-E3 drops or at the very least until the X-Pro2 drops although owners of the X-E2 are unlikely to be the demographic that will buy X-Pro2, but I will allow it for now. I don't believe that the X-E3 is coming soon, they will release X-Pro 2 first and then allow that to bed in and review market response to it before dropping the X-E3. The harsh reality is that the success of the X-T1 means that it may well be that we get an X-T2 before the X-E3. It would make sense drop X-Pro2 with 24MP sensor new processor and 4k Rangefinders crowd are happy. Drop X-T2 with same sensor and 4k SLR crowd are happy. Then follow with X-E3 and XT20 This is a sensible release path that will probably make fuji the most money from there new tech. The problem is it will leave X-E2 owners a little in the cold. WHich is why Fuji awesome company that they are will drop F4.0 on the X-E2 As mentioned its sensible. IF they do this I will stick with X-E2 buy some more glass and wait for X-E3 and be content in that wait. If they did'nt it would be well okay I have to buy an SLR style body now to improve my options. Hmm maybe that Sonay A6xxx that coming out might be worth a look as it already has better focus and good video. Granted the glass sucks in comarison to Fuji and the reality is that I am not going to do that, but people may be tempted. G

Firstly if this rumour is true that new firmware for X-E2 its amazing news and really will cement fuji reputation for Kaizen. Just my thought on the excitement I agree with Flysurfer that the bottom line is that my X-E2 is the same camera it was yesterday and if they don't update it will still be a great camera that is because it still has the same sensor as the X-T1 and X-T10. Personally though I think that is one argument for updating the firmware i.e really the same level processor and sensor should give the same features wherever you find it. As I understand it they are arguably the most expensive parts of the camera and the cost saving between the X-E2 and X-T1 at launch was mainly related to the lack of weather sealing and reduced control options (i.e no ISO or Bracket or Photmetry controls) The main compelling reason for me though as to why I think its sensible for them to do a V4 update to the X-E2 is because its a rangefinder body. If they are genuinely going to pursue a dual body style line up (which I think is very attractive to a lot of people they need to have compelling offerings in both. Currently their SLR line up is awesome X-T1 and X-T10, come June they will both be very attractive cameras with bang up to date features. The intercahngable rangefinder customer what do they currently have to choose from, the X-E2 or X-Pro 1, both are off the pace in terms of features. So a rangefinder user currently will have less choice in comparison to an SLR user in terms of features, now I am not saying that we have some devine right to them we don't but then Fuji don't have a devine right to retain customers, something which I am pleased to see that they get. Finally I mentioned the X-Pro1 just now and a few of you will be thinking stop moaning rangefinders are going to get the mother of all cameras later this year the X-Pro2 which will have all the tech in the X-T1 plus 4k, and you are right. However its going to cost an arm and a leg and not everyone wants an optical viewfinder (i know thats a bit weird as its considered the best by some) but its true. I bought the X-E2 because it had the best blend for me. Small unobtrusive rangfinder style cam, no OVF inflating the price and still interchangable lens. Perfect, and I will say now that when the X-Pro 2 hits I will actually be waiting and hoping fro an X-e3 and that it has 4k etc as that would be my ideal next body. I think the final reason here is that Fuji have not brought out an X-E3 yet. I.e I fully accept taht FUji cannot just keep releasing new firmware for old cameras for nothing, there is an R&D cost etc etc. Personally I would have no issues with a paid upgrade at this point. ANyway though the point I am trying to make here is I don't want a free lunch. But I do want the new features of hte X-T range, but in a rangefinder body. IF Fuji had just realized the X-E3 then I would upgrage to that body, I have had a good run with my current X-E2 and would probably keep it as a backup/second body and be very happy. But I can't do that becuase Fuji have not released an X-E3 so my only option if I want to upgrade to the new features ( and lets not get into a debate about whether I should, surely that is a personal choice) I have to change to an SLR body. To me that is a less than ideal compromize, and I am sure others feel that way. So I guess what I am saying is that the reason a lot of people were upset by X-T10 was they felt like they were being forced to choose between changing form factor or falling behind. THe fantastic new is that if this rumour spured by the French post is true then Fuji have been listening and we will al be happy campers. Its interesting as well because they are very clever. I have actually been holding off buying some extra glass as I did not want to become more heavily invested in the system till the dust settled. If they drop new firmware on the X-E2 then I am in this system for the long haul and will be buying the new 16mm and probably the 23mm to round out my primes over the next 18 months. So its a win for Fuji as well G

Sorry just read my post back and edited it. The sentance that said I never use my X-t1 was a typo, I own an X-E2 so should read I never use (or rarely) use the X-E2 in anything other than full manual. Still to address your point. I am looking at this camera as to what it could bring to the table above and beyond and X-E2 or X-T1, ie its a blend, its missing some things from the X-T1 but it adds good things to the X-E2. I was not really dealing with anything that they all have a solution for. Ie in terms of metering. I have the AE function button set up on my X-E2 to handle metering so I CAN do it, maybe not as easily as on the X-T1 but its there. Granted I have ISO set to the Fn2 button so its also there. But I reach for ISO more than I do metering. That might be my failing as a photographer, thats how I work. Are you saying I would have to do less ISO adjustments if I made better decisions on what metering mode I was using? Ps this comment is not meant as a challenge, I genuinely want to learn. Before I had the X-E2 I had a Lumix camera and I stayed in A priority mode. The X-E2 i bought deliberately so I could start learning more about how to use a camera properly and it has worked as I now live in Manual mode 90% of the time, but if there is a trick I am missing let me know. So far I just look through EVF and fiddle with stuff till the little voice in my head says NAILED IT. I guess i am relying on my eyes to be my meters, maybe I need to rethink For now even if changing the metering mode is a good thing to do more often, I still think being able to just reach up and tweak the Ev ring (or if I get an X-T1 the ISO ring) to slightly change my exposure without having to sacrifice my chosen SS or A would be great. I grant you that the above statement is completely predisposed on what the EV effects in 'M' mode. I have noticed in A mode if I push EV mode it changes SS, and vice versa in S mode. I await to see how the new firmware handles it. I my ideal world in 'M' mode tweaking the EV would change the ISO and leave my other settings alone. It would in effect become an ISO dial. OR an ISO fine tune dial. You get close to the ISO you want, or use Auto ISO and then if you want to expose creatively you can fine tune to get the effect you want. Very very quickly. Currently I have to press a Fn button scroll to correct ISO. shot missed. Or if its in a time critical environment ie capturing a moving scene I currently sacrifice either SS or A based on which is more important ie Good DOF or with a really quick moving subject relatively high SS. This is just my personal thinking and the way I shoot, so I accept my original post and this one is assessing the X-T10 in terms of what it could bring to my photography. My hope is that I am not a complete whacko and others might be in a simlar position.

I think the really interesting thing is that after all the feedback on the X-t1 about the D-Pad they have gone with the same solution as opposed to reverting to the button design from the X-E2 Given that the whole reason for that design was touted as weather sealing that leaves 2 options 1) Exciting - Its actually weather sealed - Unlikely given that the shutter button is threaded like X-E2 and there is not alternate rubber capped shutter release socket. 2) Disappointing, its not weather sealed and its still has annoying d-pad. Personally as an X-E2 user there is a lot to like about this camera, putting aside my disappointment about the fact that it is unlikely that they will be upgrading the X-E2 again. This camera has a nice balance of features if rumors can be believed. Manual VIdeo Drive Control which means you can go to video mode BEFORE recording video allowing you to frame your shot. Built in flash Tilt screen EV wheel works in Full Manual mode (which in some ways negates need for ISO wheel so this means that the lack of one compared to X-T1 is not as significant as before the new firmware. New AF Zone focus which it sounds like we won't get for the X-E2 Dials are non locking which is a personal preference thing, but for me I think better. View Mode button Full Auto (don't get me wrong I never use my X-E2 in full auto, in fact most of the time its in full manual and occasionally full manual with Auto ISO but its a pain when I ask someone else in my family to take a picture as its a bit complicated to change everything back. This is actually useful flick switch hand camera to family member, picture taken camera handed back flick switch and you are back where you were before) So in some ways it fills a niche that the X-T1 does not. Advantages of X-t1 that remain are to me EVF (this is a biggie though) Looks nicer (personal pref) ISO Dial Weather Sealing More function buttons Which begs the question everyone assumes this is going to eat the X-E2's lunch, but I wander if given that its SLR in style it might end up eating the X-T1's lunch, as rangefinder guys might just wait it out till the X-Pro2 My 2 pennyworth.