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Big Hands


andrew brown
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I love the Fuji X cameras, I really do. I gave up my whole Canon pro kit for it.

 

After having a break from photography, I'm now about to return with Fuji kit.

 

Initially I was getting another X-Pro 1 - when the XT-10 was annunced. How many boxes did that tick? I pre-ordered straight away.

 

Then I discovered how small it was going to be - and no sign of having the option of adding a decent battery grip to it.

 

My hands are just TOO BIG to hold a camera of a certain size and work with - so I had to cancel.

 

Now I've ordered an X-100T instead, after conversations with Mr Damien Lovegrove.

 

I do not have the budget for an XT-1 system, and TBH, not sure I really have then need.

 

I'm very much a camera goes every where with me sort of person, so the compact nature of the camera is great, enabling me to fit it in my pocket to carry around.

 

But please - could Fuji just rememeber those of use with hands more suited to holding a Canon 1Dx or Nikon D4s when designing camera bodies...

 

The X-Pro 1 was a perfect size for me in terms of small yet 'practical to hold'.

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Not sure whether i've understood correctly ... which cam was too small for you?

However ... the x100 is always the smallest when compared to X-Pro1, X-T1 and X-T10 .... 

 

I think there is a "manual" additional grip for the x100 ... but no batteries included, no buttons ...

 

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Sorry if my post confused.

 

The X-T10 is too small for my hands.

 

The X100T with grip fits my hands fine - but not as well as the X-Pro 1. Can't afford an X-T1 with grip, but I know from a hold that my hands work with that model also.

 

My point is - do Fuji have to keep making the camera bodies smaller and smaller?

 

I appreciate that technology in itself gets smaller with refinement - but as they discovered with mobile phones, there comes a point when small becomes impractical to use.

 

And I just wonder if Fuji are reaching this point? Or are my hands THAT much bigger than every one elses?

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The X-T10 is too small for my hands.

 

Then don't buy it.

 

Can't afford an X-T1 with grip, but I know from a hold that my hands work with that model also.

Then buy it second hand or wait for the price to drop. See, no problems, only solutions.

 

My point is - do Fuji have to keep making the camera bodies smaller and smaller?

Their main market is Asia, deal with it.

 

Stop whining how a company doesn't design its stuff especially to suit YOU (we understand how important you are but I'm not sure they do) and either adapt or switch brand.

 

Do I complain how an Austin mini is too small for my 1m93? No I drive a Mercedes. Adapt or live unhappy.

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Glad to see you entering into the spirit of a conversation...

 

So ALL the people in Asia have little hands? Didn't realise...

Um - what actually is a 1m93? Other than the identifying number of a train I used to drive from Suffolk up to the North West of England?

 

As for making stuff epscially to suit me, I didn't realise I was the only person with hands as big as mine, but thanks for the info, I"ll make a point of contacting the Guinness Book of Records so I can get my entry into their publication :-)

Then, Fuji might adapt one of their bodies for me to actualy fit my hands and give it a nice marketing name and sell a limited edition for the fans I might acquite along the way ;-)

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Hi Andrew,

 

You are not alone. 

 

Here is a quote from the following review.

"The handling of the X-T10 could either be it’s most winning feature, or it’s biggest failing. Subjectivity comes into play, but shooting style will also matter. To sum up, the X-T10 isn’t particularly well built for marathon shooting sessions. It’s a camera you keep slung around your shoulder, neck or wrist for hours on end, grabbing pics here and there. This camera is wonderfully small, but it’s so small, you will probably have a hard time acquiring a grip that’s comfortable for an extended period of time, unless you are a toddler. I’m not kidding, I have relatively small hands, but even my wife at 5 feet and change with even smaller hands found the X-T1 more pleasant to hold immediately. The X-T10 isn’t bad, but it won’t fit like a glove the same way the X-T1 does for many people."

http://www.fujivsfuji.com/fujifilm-xt10-review/

 

I find most of the grip on Fuji bodies too small compared to DSLRs also. Fuji realizes this and this is why they make additional optional grips for most all of their cameras.  Its no accident, its a profit making opportunity. 

 

I have both an X-E1 and X-T1. Even those were a little too small for me and have the additional grip on both. So I just budget in and additional $100+ for all the Fuji bodies when  considering buying one for myself or my spouse. 

Adding the grip to X-E1, made it about the same grip as the X-T1 without any optional grip. It is still not enough, but better than nothing.  Adding  the standard optional grip to the X-T1 made it made it much better than the X-E1 w/ grip.   I can't imagine getting an X-T10 without a grip. It would remind me too much of the OM-D EM-5 and EM-10. Completely unacceptable.   I was not impressed with the optional grips for those models. 

 

Anyhow, this is one of the reasons that Fuji and Olympus make bigger camera and charge more.  i.e. X-T1 and OM-D EM-1.  Bigger body, more grip and more direct controls.    

 

IMHO, buying a used X-T1 is a great suggestion by citral.  Also gives you more money to buy either the standard or large optional grips for it; if you choose.  If you are like me, then you may want to consider either the standard metal or large optional hand grip added to the stock XT-1. 

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Glad to see you entering into the spirit of a conversation...

 

So ALL the people in Asia have little hands? Didn't realise...

Um - what actually is a 1m93? Other than the identifying number of a train I used to drive from Suffolk up to the North West of England?

 

As for making stuff epscially to suit me, I didn't realise I was the only person with hands as big as mine, but thanks for the info, I"ll make a point of contacting the Guinness Book of Records so I can get my entry into their publication :-)

Then, Fuji might adapt one of their bodies for me to actualy fit my hands and give it a nice marketing name and sell a limited edition for the fans I might acquite along the way ;-)

 

That's around 6"4. So I have really long fingers. But I don't complain, if a lens is too big and feels unbalanced, you shoud support it with one hand, way better than adding as much grip as you can on the body to hold it with two hands, will never be as stable.

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citral,

I think most people support large lens with two hands. A larger grip makes it even better if you shot for an extended period.  You feel it each time you raise the camera into position.  If you don't mind having a smaller grip, that is great. For most people coming from DSLRs, they see value in it.  Its would be a foolish argument to attempt to prove otherwise.   As they say, you don't know what you missing until you have had something better. Many people come to the Fuji brand from DSLRs, where the grip is a standard luxury. 

 

Its like heated seats in a car. Once you have them, you don't tend to go back easily.  For those who never had them in a car they owned, they think its silly. Just put on a jacket.

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Well if you ditch your DSLR for Fuji it's usually to get a smaller / lighter package so the argument seems moot to me, you have to make do with the inconveniances coming with it.

 

I know people who stay with DSLRs for this very reason (big hands, mirrorless doesn't feel right etc.) and I say very well. To each his own.

 

Now if I ask them if they always take their camera with them when they go for a walk the answer is invariably no.

 

You can't have everything in this world.

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Well if you ditch your DSLR for Fuji it's usually to get a smaller / lighter package so the argument seems moot to me, you have to make do with the inconveniances coming with it.

 

sure, but you can minimize the impact by picking a body with larger grip . So it's not completely moot. You still end up with something smaller and lighter.  Just not the absolutely smallest and lightest.   Its like buying a small fuel efficent car, but opting to pay extra for the hatchback or wagon/estate instead of the sedan.  It has value for some people.

 

btw, I have a 1"  sensor camera that is smaller than my Fuji.  That too has a very substantial grip that is more comfortable than my X-E1 without the grip.    Its a Nikon 1 V2.   There are other Nikon 1 models without the grip and EVF like the J series as well as the Sony RX100.  For someone coming from a DSLR, the model with the EVF and larger grip will be preferred.  From someone coming from a smartphone, they could probably care less and just go for the slimmer J series without the EVF and added grip.  The Sony RX100 and J series are unacceptable to ME, due to the lack of grip. However, they have no issues selling them to most others who are not as picky as I am. 

 

Again, it all boils down to what is important to each person and what you are used to using.   If there is an option for larger grip, even on a tiny camera like the Nikon 1 series, I will pick it given the option.  Just like I would pick a wagon/estate in a small car over a sedan.   It might be slightly larger, heavier, less fuel efficient, not as attractive, more expensive.. but in the end.. its all a very worthwhile trade off to ME. 

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my cameras vs grip sizes.

 

from left to right (i.e. largest to smallest sensor).

Nikon D600 (Full Frame), Fuji X-T1 (1.5 crop) w/ normal optional grip, Nikon 1 V2 (2.7 crop).  iPhone 5s (7.21 crop) for reference.

 

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

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Seriously how big are some people's hands? I'm 1m95 (6ft5 for those of you still using medieval measurements), and by all standards I have really big hands... And I've never had issues with any camera, not a DSLR, not a small Micro Four Thirds system. First of all, a camera should be held by the lens barrel. The back hand is for support, not the main grip... That's how it was tought for decades and this still applies today. That grip should be comfortable on any camera body, unless you are using large telephoto lenses and need extra support...

 

Also, how did everyone manage to hold a camera before the advent of the big DSLRs? Surely there were big people then too...

 

I use the X-T1 with the battery grip sometimes, and that's already a huge camera for my taste... Big hands or no big hands...

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I have fairly big hands (XL size gloves) and the X100S is fine for me and I'm coming from a 1DX (which feels great if it weren't so heavy). Once you fall in love with the X100T you can go from there. Maybe it will be all you need or like me it will be the gateway drug to the full line of Fuji lenses and X-T1 (or X-T2, whatever is out). I still have my X100S and sometimes take it out on the street when I don't want the larger camera.

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To try and explain a bit better, because clearly I'm failing to do so thus far.

 

I hold an interchangeable lens style camera with body resting in my left hand and lens supported by the fingers of said left hand which also operate any rings or switches fitted to the lens.

My right hand is used to hold the grip and work the myriad of dials joystick and control wheels fitted to most modern cameras.

 

Now, before you jump in, I'm well aware that is the correct way of holding a camera - and the X-Pro 1 was an ideal minimum size for this, as is (apparently) the XT-1.

But an even smaller XT-10 becomes too small as my hands are about 4 - 5 inches wide - hence that base plate gets a bit congested by my hands.

 

I got fed up of lugging the big stuff around and was willing to accept the compromise of smaller bodies - but as was said for a while about mobile phones before the introduction of smartphones - how much smaller can things practically get?

 

I've purchased an X-100T and because it is a compact style camera, my hands can work with it ok.

 

I just wish Fuji would stick at making camera bodies for interchangeable lenses at about the size of an X-Pro 1 or XT-1.

I do not think I am the only one with hands the size of mine who wants to use a modern compact system camera.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

 

I find most of the grip on Fuji bodies too small compared to DSLRs also. Fuji realizes this and this is why they make additional optional grips for most all of their cameras.  Its no accident, its a profit making opportunity. 

 

 

I look at the grip situation, as you describe it in your first paragraph, from a diametrically opposite viewpoint. By designing the X-T1 as they have Fuji have allowed those who want a small body with a small grip at the front to have one. If a larger grip is needed then they provide two of different sizes so that the desired size of body grip can be obtained. This allows the grip size to be tailored to the owners preference. If the largest grip were fitted as standard then that is the only choice. It is possible, as now, to add to a camera grip, but impossible to make it smaller without severely damaging the camera. 

 

I have the largest grip fitted to my camera for normal use, but like the option of removing it when the camera has to be as discrete as possible.

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 I think that sums up the nub of it. You can always make something bigger with add ons, but you can never make them smaller.

 

Maybe the truth is - I'm the one out of step with the rest of the world :-(

 

At least with thr X 100T I have a camera that I can work with ok. Being a compact, it allows tyou to hold it diifferently to a SLR style camera...

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I'm with you Andrew. I have big meat paws and the X-Pro1 with the HG-XPro1 and thumb rest fits my hand wonderfully. I like a small body and find it doesn't intimidate my subjects in the studio or draw attention on the streets. For a while I owned the X-T1 with the vertical battery grip it was fine but the small buttons were the issue. For now I eagerly await the X-Pro2 and hope Fuji doesn't shrink the camera and controls.

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I'm in much the same boat, though I am getting on with the X-T10 okay after having 'trained' myself to get used to smaller cameras with the X100S and X-T1. My hands aren't that large but my fingers are proportionately long, so with anything smaller than a 1D X my little and ring fingers are left hanging in the air. I probably would still exclusively use the 1D X and medium format cameras if my back wasn't so bad; I am now very limited by how much weight I can carry. If there's ever some kind of 'lightweight' 1D or somebody makes a mirrorless camera larger than the X-T1 & grip, I'll gladly buy those. I still prefer a larger unit, despite having gotten used to smaller cameras now.

To that end, I do recommend saving for a T1 (you can buy them second hand for not much more than a T10 costs) and giving that a try, or consider using a smaller, entry-level DSLR, which are typically the size of a T1, to get used to handling a smaller body. Work your way down.

A tip I picked up from Mr. Lovegrove is holding the camera vertically with one hand, without the need for a 1D/D4 style body or a battery grip. He often holds his cameras with his left hand around the lens, index finger on the shutter, which gives you one-handed vertical operation without the need for a grip. Trying that out helped me a lot with the transition from larger bodies to these smaller ones.
For horizontal shooting, I now simply curl in my little and ring fingers up into my palm, with the near edge of the camera resting on the second knuckle of my ring finger. It's not ideal, but it's a little more stable and doesn't look quite as silly as having two fingers just waving about on nothing. Give it a try with the X100T.

And by the way, my understanding is that the X-T10 was made precisely because the X-T1 was proving popular, but a little too large and expensive to really take hold as well as Fuji would have liked. The X-T10's lower price mostly comes from the fact it is smaller. The impression I have been given is that it would not really be viable to make a T1-size body at the price point of the T10; they wouldn't make enough money back on it. (As it is, the T1 itself only generates around £40 profit per body sold.) So it is very, very unlikely Fuji will ever make a body of the Pro/T1 size at the T10 price point. This is where you will need to wait for a body to be a couple of years old or replaced by a new generation, and then search for a secondhand unit.
 

There is an optional grip for the X-T10. MHG-XT10

It's a tiny add-on that just deepens the finger grip, it does not actually make the silhouette of the camera larger. It's good for people like me where the main problem is finger length, and a deeper grip helps accommodate, but for overall large hands it is of no benefit at all.
Also they're charging £90 for it and that's a bloody joke.

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My hands are fairly large without being shovels ( size 11 to 12 in gloves terms you will see that L or XL varies while a number for size is a better and more objective comparison element), so I’ve never been too comfortable with small cameras such as the Olympus OM series of when I was young .

 

Some other hand problems are due to a number of conditions affecting my hands and after carpal tunnel surgeries to both my hands ( and being affected by thumb arthritis at each thumb) I have lost quite a bit of finger dexterity and often drop objects although I play saxophone.

 

Despite this I find the X-T1 well suited to my hands, and, although I have added an extra L bracket with front grip, I have to say that it makes very little difference because the front grip is really not very big.

 

Also the other controls, mostly thumb or forefinger activated, are not too difficult to use.

 

Maybe playing saxophone helps me and having had a go at playing german bassoon, where the left thumb plays 10 different notes, puts things in a different perspective.

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I find the grip of XE-2 insufficient not only because ergonomics but weight. Those extra grams on XPro-1 and little bit wide give more balance on big hands. 

 

I have a pair of analogue OM1 and FM10 and the little extra volume (similar to Pro1) on those bodies gives a better handling even with long or heavy lenses.

 

Luckily a soft release and thumb rest improves the ergonomics of the XE-2 with native prime lenses but I can say the same with adapted legacy SLR long lenses or faster XF zooms.   

 

I hope the rumored Pro2 keeps the size and volume of its predecessor. 

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I don't think one "too small" camera for Andrew makes a trend. FUJI is just trying to capture additional market share. Perhaps the M4/3 crowd ?

 

Citral's not so tactful comments makes me wonder though about how big the American market is vs the Asian market. It's too glib a response to blame it on "the FUJI cameras being built" for the Asian market. I can see that perhaps the T-10 was built for the Asian market exclusively, and is being sold all over.

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