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X-PRO 2 ......a little disappointed but still going with it!


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Have you seen what people can do with the xpro2, to say it isn't capable of fast action, something wrong?

Use this as a guide!

http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2016/04/06/fujifilm-100-400mm-review/

http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2016/03/30/fuji-x-pro2-ovf-birds-in-flight/

 

Thank you, will read...but as mentioned before The focusing isn't that bad......its  changing the focal length mid shooting.....i don't shoot one focal length and leave it at that i continue shooting at 8 fps i expect to be able to do this even with the optical viewfinder. if i release shutter, i can change focal length.....but the delay in doing this i miss the action......

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i don't shoot one focal length and leave it at that i change and continue shooting at 8 fps i expect to be able to do this even with the optical viewfinder.

There are two aspects to a good photo:

1. A main subject that's in focus

2. A pleasing composition that balances the main subject with the other objects in the frame and tells a story that engaged the viewer's emotions

 

The rangefinder-style X Pro 2 has an OVF that lets you see objects coming into or going out of the frame, to help you get the best possible composition. It's not designed for a style of photography that changes the parameters of the frame constantly by zooming in and out while shooting. A DSLR is better for that

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I'm not sure that the XPro2 is ideal for the kind of photography that involves shooting in high-speed burst mode at the same time as zooming in and out. It's more a 'considered photography' sort of camera than a 'spray and pray' one: you see the picture, you frame it, you capture it. The optical viewfinder in particular makes it most suitable for prime lenses between 18mm and 56mm

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

I guess so.....i expected more from the Fuji X pro 2 I'm not a "Spray and Pray man"... : ) Im just able to consider more than one frame...in an normal action scene! And not get one good frame....but a series of good considered shots. Or i wouldn't be employed very much.

 

So yes DSLR's are more suitable with Zooms for commercial action photography..... 

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Have you seen what people can do with the xpro2, to say it isn't capable of fast action, something wrong?

Use this as a guide!

http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2016/04/06/fujifilm-100-400mm-review/

http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2016/03/30/fuji-x-pro2-ovf-birds-in-flight/

 

What is possible and what is ideal are two different things.

 

I have no doubt that I _could_ photograph birds or sports with my Fujifilm cameras, but when I photograph those things I use my DSLR because it is better with those fast-moving subjects. I also have no doubt that I could do my night street photography with my DSLRs, but I prefer to use my Fujifilm bodies because I'll get better results.

 

I'm a big Fujifilm fan, but I'm also honest (based on a lot of experience) about where its strengths and weaknesses are.

 

Dan

Edited by gdanmitchell
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Well it did mention it could do it....like most other PRO cameras on the market? Didn't have the freedom to test on different jobs and handing back! Its becoming a back up camera in my kit or more a documentary camera only! Im 70% happy with it.

 

"The simple shot i refer to was a group of people walking fast towards me!!!! I missed the end part as i couldn't zoom wider"

 

The focusing isn't that bad......its  changing the focal length mid shooting.....i don't shoot one focal length and leave it at that i change and continue shooting at 8 fps i expect to be able to do this even with the optical viewfinder. 

 

 

I was out the other day with the X-Pro2 shooting cars as they were coming towards me and going away. Most shots were in focus.

 

Different cameras function in different ways. It requires workflow adjustment from the photographer. In your example, lift your finger from the shutter and zoom then shoot again. It is not that you couldn't zoom wider, it is that you were adhering to a workflow developed with another camera and not working with the camera in hand according to its capabilities. 

 

No offense meant and of course it is entirely up to you to do it however you wish and use which camera you wish. 

 

I'm just saying that the X-Pro2 can give excellent results, but one would have to work with it, not try to make it be something else. And there is nothing wrong with someone just using a pro DSLR instead. 

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I was out the other day with the X-Pro2 shooting cars as they were coming towards me and going away. Most shots were in focus.

 

Different cameras function in different ways. It requires workflow adjustment from the photographer. In your example, lift your finger from the shutter and zoom then shoot again. It is not that you couldn't zoom wider, it is that you were adhering to a workflow developed with another camera and not working with the camera in hand according to its capabilities. 

 

No offense meant and of course it is entirely up to you to do it however you wish and use which camera you wish. 

 

I'm just saying that the X-Pro2 can give excellent results, but one would have to work with it, not try to make it be something else. And there is nothing wrong with someone just using a pro DSLR instead. 

 

Focus not bad, just zooming and recomposing while firing as stated earlier....

 

From Fuji   kindly confirming what my issue is.....

 

Quote : - In the OVF the Bright frame will freeze on the focal length at the start of the burst but the EVF and LCD do change if you zoom in or out although the effect display will be staggered.

 

"Staggered" is a understatement, as following action is a challenge... group of people walking towards me. Not even high speed action.. So yes a DSLR is called for.

But will stick to the primes, so my 16-55 will be on eBay very soon! : )

 

 

 

 

The Fujifilm X World Team

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On the banding problem you noticed, are you using electronic shutter? I have only noticed it when using the E-Shutter never in mechanical shutter.

 

I find the 16-55/2.8 [my copy anyway] very sharp from 16mm right up to 55mm as well as fast to lock focus, there have been a few times when it simply fails to lock, as has my 5D3, but I just grab the focus ring and twist, it zooms in & I shoot. I'd never manage to get that going on the canon.

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Focus not bad, just zooming and recomposing while firing as stated earlier....

 

From Fuji   kindly confirming what my issue is.....

 

Quote : - In the OVF the Bright frame will freeze on the focal length at the start of the burst but the EVF and LCD do change if you zoom in or out although the effect display will be staggered.

 

"Staggered" is a understatement, as following action is a challenge... group of people walking towards me. Not even high speed action.. So yes a DSLR is called for.

But will stick to the primes, so my 16-55 will be on eBay very soon! : )

 

 

 

 

The Fujifilm X World Team

Only so much the X Processor Pro can handle at this point in history. I believe you will face the same problem with any other mirror less systems out there.

 

DSLRs don't need to worry as they use real time TTL OVF. No processing needed.

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Only so much the X Processor Pro can handle at this point in history. I believe you will face the same problem with any other mirror less systems out there.

 

DSLRs don't need to worry as they use real time TTL OVF. No processing needed.

 

Actually, there is a TON of data processing going on in a DSLR, but much of the data is coming from a (comparatively) huge, dedicated PDAF sensor array (not a few masked pixels on an imaging sensor). This combination is exceptionally good at reading and even anticipating subject movement but not quite as good as "mirrorless" CD systems focus accuracy and repeatability. The two systems will eventually converge (some convergence has already happened) but I suspect the camera with a dedicated PDAF sensor will always have the upper hand for random movement. That's provided that all the mechanical systems that are in a DSLR are in perfect alignment - but of course they rarely are! (Well, less often than one might think!)

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Actually, there is a TON of data processing going on in a DSLR, but much of the data is coming from a (comparatively) huge, dedicated PDAF sensor array (not a few masked pixels on an imaging sensor). This combination is exceptionally good at reading and even anticipating subject movement but not quite as good as "mirrorless" CD systems focus accuracy and repeatability. The two systems will eventually converge (some convergence has already happened) but I suspect the camera with a dedicated PDAF sensor will always have the upper hand for random movement. That's provided that all the mechanical systems that are in a DSLR are in perfect alignment - but of course they rarely are! (Well, less often than one might think!)

 

True what you say. By keeping the feedback OVF completely mechanical and away from the main and PDAF processors, spinneyhorse don't have to go through the staggered and lagging feedback of the currently available evf tech when he shoots while zooming.

 

I'm eagerly waiting for the day when Fujifilm plonks in a 2nd processor just to take care of focusing and AF chores.

 

X-Pro3, Dual X-Processor Pro Engines! 8k video with 120hz slo mo ability! Even from a marketing point of view, it rocks. :D

Edited by Aswald
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  • 3 weeks later...

Woudl not continuous Af fix that. With X-T1 and 18-135 if I change zoom during a burst in continous AF mode due to it re-focusing constantly it absorbs and chance in focus caused by varifocalness.

 

Another thing to check is do you have Focus priority set to Release or Focus. If its set to release it will just fire of as many shots as possible. IF you set it to focus it will wait until it thinks its locked before firing shutter. You get less shots in a burst and they stutter, but you get more keepers. Expereiemtn

 

I would also advize trying this with Zone AF and possibly at F4 to give yourself more DOF and latitude for error.

 

Not saying this makes it better than any other manufacturer, but I like how Fuji files look enough to have searched for workarounds, and teh above works well for me.

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You are not missing anything.

If your shooting habit/style is to zoom in and out constantly without any opportunity to focus again, you have two choices. (1) adjust your habits or (2) go back to Canon

 

What you are referring to is, yes, indeed called a "focus-shift" while zooming in or out. It is due to each lens' specific focusing mechanism and design and has NOTHING to do with any particular brand.

 

As an ex-Canon user, there are some lenses that do not shift focus, or shift only little when zoomed in or out. But I also know there are countless other Canon zoom lenses where its not he case. Its a unique design chracteristic for each lens model - regardless of brand. So you can and will have the same issue whether you go Nikon or many other Canon lenses.

 

Again, to answer your q on Fuji zoom lens's focus shifting, some Fuji lenses shift focus more than other models, but most Fuji lenses focus shift due to zooming in/out I know are not any more prominent than most Canon/Nikon lenses. But if its a problem for you, theres nothing missing here.

 

Lastly, Id just like to know - why is it such a problem? Why not just refocus?

As convenient as it may sound to not have to refocus after zooming in/out, such 'feature' usually comes at the price of sacrificing other lens design characteristics. Designing a zoom lens is a tricky proposition, and optimizing for no/minimum lens distortion and consistent quality(resolutiona, chromatic char, etc.) across zooming range typically (and often indespensibly) require some shift of focus as being zoomed in/out

Edited by youngleex
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I wonder if high performance mode would make a difference. It apparently makes the EFV "not flicker" according to something I just read.

 

It could speed up the EVF refresh during a high-speed-burst-action-zoom™ enough to make tracking the action possible.

 

You'd just need to buy more batteries.

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I'm not sure that the XPro2 is ideal for the kind of photography that involves shooting in high-speed burst mode at the same time as zooming in and out. It's more a 'considered photography' sort of camera than a 'spray and pray' one: you see the picture, you frame it, you capture it. The optical viewfinder in particular makes it most suitable for prime lenses between 18mm and 56mm

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

I couldn't agree more with this statement. I have a Fuji kit and a Canon kit. I use the Canons for Weddings or any paid job where I can't afford to miss a shot. I use the Fujis for my walkaround/landscape/personal photography. I still miss shots with the Canons, but usually it's because I'm not quick enough, not because the camera isn't quick enough. When I shoot with the Fujis, it always seems like they have a hard time keeping up, which diverts my attention off my subjects and ultimately frustrates me. I know there are folks out there who use Fujis in a professional capacity, but I cannot. And the trade-off in weight savings doesn't justify all the other 'quirks' I have to put up with. I need my professional equipment to be responsive and dependable. I have enough to worry about on a shoot without the stress of batteries dying suddenly, or the camera freezing up, or overheating because I've used it for hours on end, or the autofocus causing me to miss shots. I like Fujis for what they are, but they have a long way to go to catch up to the Canikons of the world - even with the latest advancements (XPro2, etc).

 

It's for that reason that I don't think it's even fair to try compare the two, or expect that Fujis should be as good as a pro DSLR. Maybe one day they will be to the point that they can be compared, but for now they are not even in the same category.

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I couldn't agree more with this statement. I have a Fuji kit and a Canon kit. I use the Canons for Weddings or any paid job where I can't afford to miss a shot. I use the Fujis for my walkaround/landscape/personal photography. I still miss shots with the Canons, but usually it's because I'm not quick enough, not because the camera isn't quick enough. When I shoot with the Fujis, it always seems like they have a hard time keeping up, which diverts my attention off my subjects and ultimately frustrates me. I know there are folks out there who use Fujis in a professional capacity, but I cannot. And the trade-off in weight savings doesn't justify all the other 'quirks' I have to put up with. I need my professional equipment to be responsive and dependable. I have enough to worry about on a shoot without the stress of batteries dying suddenly, or the camera freezing up, or overheating because I've used it for hours on end, or the autofocus causing me to miss shots. I like Fujis for what they are, but they have a long way to go to catch up to the Canikons of the world - even with the latest advancements (XPro2, etc).

 

It's for that reason that I don't think it's even fair to try compare the two, or expect that Fujis should be as good as a pro DSLR. Maybe one day they will be to the point that they can be compared, but for now they are not even in the same category.

May I know which Fujifilm camera you use in context to the posting you made above?

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And the trade-off in weight savings doesn't justify all the other 'quirks' I have to put up with. I need my professional equipment to be responsive and dependable. I have enough to worry about on a shoot without the stress of batteries dying suddenly, or the camera freezing up, or overheating because I've used it for hours on end, or the autofocus causing me to miss shots. I like Fujis for what they are, but they have a long way to go to catch up to the Canikons of the world - even with the latest advancements (XPro2, etc).

 

 

It's funny how the expectations have changed.

 

I worked as a pro photographer for years doing commercial location shoots with mostly manual focus and sometimes no motor drive (35mm and MF). The wedding photographers I knew were using Hassleblad cameras which apparently also needed to 'catch up' to the Canikons of the world.

 

I feel no stress about the batteries in my Fuji cameras. I keep some extra charged ones on hand and it takes 15 seconds to switch. It is a trivial non issue. Far less than changing film.

 

Especially with the latest Fuji lenses, I find the autofocus fast enough for weddings and all but the most demanding of situations. But then I was trained in a time when it was the photographer who had to be paying attention, be fast enough and have a sense of the moment. Today's Fuji cameras are remarkably fast compared to cameras some decades ago. I would not have the slightest hesitation to shoot weddings with the current Fuji gear. 

 

You are free to make whatever choices suit you... I am simply offering a different perspective.

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Obviously people have been making wonderful images for decades with all different types of equipment. But for me, if I know I have to get the shot, I personally find myself reaching for a DSLR instead of the Fuji kit simply because my confidence level is higher. Of course, as you implied, I could just be a schlep who doesn't know how to use his equipment effectively, but to each his own.

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Of course, as you implied, I could just be a schlep who doesn't know how to use his equipment effectively, but to each his own.

 

 

I wasn't implying that... Different times give different results. For example, today there is not much need to learn to manually focus fast by feel and eye. Before there was autofocus, your livelihood depended on it. Doesn't mean someone today who has not developed that skill is an idiot or incapable of doing so. They are just not forced to it by the circumstance.

 

My X-T1 can shoot 8 frames per second. With a 35mm film camera and a 36 exposure roll of film, that is 4 1/2 seconds before needing to change the roll of film! 

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