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Fujifilm X-PRO2 rumors


Patrick FR

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Hell.... it's a given what? x-trans or bayer???

She naturally wouldn't go into specifics.  Just that the natural progression is to bump the resolution up to 24mp, and make the changes that come along with it, etc...Fuji will announce when they are sure they have it correct.

 

that information hasn’t seen the light , yet, hence, wasn’t given  :rolleyes:

Direct from a Fuji rep..What more do you want? :rolleyes:

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What I fail to understand is why would Fujifilm discount lenses across the line if there is no change in the sensor size? Are sweeping discounts indicating that current lenses will become less attractive come January? A resolution bump does not warrant a new lens line, does it? It that an indication of a new sensor format?

 

The reason I am concerned is that I am an E1/100S owner, with a trip coming up in the beginning of January 2016. I hoped to get the Fujifilm XF 90mm f/2 R LM WR lens for the trip and use it on a new body purchased later in the year. Is it wise at all given how widespread are the discounts?

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What I fail to understand is why would Fujifilm discount lenses across the line if there is no change in the sensor size? Are sweeping discounts indicating that current lenses will become less attractive come January? A resolution bump does not warrant a new lens line, does it? It that an indication of a new sensor format?

 

The reason I am concerned is that I am an E1/100S owner, with a trip coming up in the beginning of January 2016. I hoped to get the Fujifilm XF 90mm f/2 R LM WR lens for the trip and use it on a new body purchased later in the year. Is it wise at all given how widespread are the discounts?

Buy it.  There is no reason (nor indication) they would change the sensor size of the Pro2 or the XT-2.

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Looking at those specs as shown  by Magnum - it seems that the 24mp has come at a cost.

 

But then, assuming those leaked specs are true- are they ALL of the specs?

 

There is much to like about that camera going by those specs alone and I could easily see an enormous take up of such a body.

 

However, I'm still learning how ot master the X100T so it will be at least Xmas 2016 before I consider such a purchase...

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Not sure what you mean by the 24 mp having come at a cost? I see no other spec that has declined (if the minor specs are correct, it doesn't seem to pick up a few desired X-T1 features that the X-Pro1 didn't have, most notably the tilt screen). That isn't a cost compared to its predecessor - it's a feature pickup from another model that didn't happen. It may well be a durability issue - note that NONE of the Nikon D4s, Canon 1Dx, Nikon D810 or Canon 5Ds (or their predecessors) have an articulated screen of any description, despite the fact that they are common on $500 DSLRs - the only camera that claims pro-level durability and DOES have an articulated screen (limited, tilt-only) is the E-M1 - the X-T1 is almost certainly the second most durable camera with that feature.  I suspect that it is being left off the Pro2 on purpose, because they don't think they can make it sturdy enough (unless it's actually there, and simply hasn't been leaked - I don't think they are leaving it off to maintain differentiation from the X-T line, nor because they forgot it)...

        I wonder if the articulated screen craze is on the way out, to be replaced by really good Wi-Fi and apps? The Fuji Wi-Fi app is already relatively useful, and it's not hard to imagine a remote screen app getting good enough to replace most uses of an articulated screen - the exception is handheld shots at really high or low angles - for anything on a tripod, the phone screen is clearly superior (and a phone mount suitable for shooting handheld could be built). The X-T1 rear screen is only a little higher than VGA resolution (it's almost certainly VGA, but wider to accommodate 3:2 instead of 4:3), and that is close to state of the art for camera screens - the brand-new, super high tech A7rII is barely higher (a 16:9 variant of the same basic resolution?). Even cheap phones from the past few years are WXGA or better, and many newer phones are Full HD (or even higher - there are even a very few 4k smartphones, just in case you want to use a focusing loupe from your old 4x5 view camera). Why don't camera manufacturers buy phone panels (in smaller sizes)? It may be a power question?

      Is there another missing feature? I didn't find one, but I might be missing something?

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I hope that Fuji will keep the Pro2 as puristic as the Pro1. The T2 will follow soon with all the bells and whistles. But with the Pro2, I don't want a tilt screen. No videos. No wifi. Not even live view. Just a perfect photo camera that can became a natural part of me. The new Leica M 262 comes close to that. My dream for January is a Pro2 WR with 24mp and the hybrid VF of the 100T. For now all rumors are promising...

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I hope that Fuji will keep the Pro2 as puristic as the Pro1. The T2 will follow soon with all the bells and whistles. But with the Pro2, I don't want a tilt screen. No videos. No wifi. Not even live view. Just a perfect photo camera that can became a natural part of me. The new Leica M 262 comes close to that. My dream for January is a Pro2 WR with 24mp and the hybrid VF of the 100T. For now all rumors are promising...

Well, X-Pro1 has live view. Why not having live view with X-Pro 2?  

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I hope that Fuji will keep the Pro2 as puristic as the Pro1. The T2 will follow soon with all the bells and whistles. But with the Pro2, I don't want a tilt screen. No videos. No wifi. Not even live view. Just a perfect photo camera that can became a natural part of me. The new Leica M 262 comes close to that. My dream for January is a Pro2 WR with 24mp and the hybrid VF of the 100T. For now all rumors are promising...

 

The opposite of pure—reducing a state of the art digital camera to the limitations of a film camera. Purism with a digital camera implements the state of the art features available at the time of manufacture in my opinion. A stripped down digital camera is simply a crippled camera that would require constant workarounds to overcome its limitations. That is totally contrary to the spirit of digital photography.

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The opposite of pure—reducing a state of the art digital camera to the limitations of a film camera. Purism with a digital camera implements the state of the art features available at the time of manufacture in my opinion. A stripped down digital camera is simply a crippled camera that would require constant workarounds to overcome its limitations. That is totally contrary to the spirit of digital photography.

 

I agree with this statement 100%. As fun as a simple, pure photographic experience is, some of us also use these cameras as tools and require state of the art tech.  Otherwise it feels I'm buying a piece of photographic jewellery.

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you want purist, buy a film camera, thats purist. theres nothing complicated or 'in the way' about features one will not use--simply dont use them! what a thought! ive never ever shot a video, but i also have never prayed to the camera god that the next camera i bought didnt have it. what do i care if it does--i just dont use it. it is a feature of every cam ive bought, and never once did it 'get in my way'. dont even know its there. you dont want an articulating screen? make believe you dont have one! i have one on my rd1 and it never 'gets in my way' because i never use it!

 

for others these non purist features are actually tools thst they do in fact use. an articulating screen is a great aid in discreet shooting. but how does that possible use get in the way of one who doesnt use it? or video? or live view? you know whats not 'purist'? freaking auto focus! face recognition! auto metering! i shoot manual lenses 90% of the time, so i guess i should pray the xp2 doesnt have autofocus! how would the purists like that?

 

sorry for the rant, but this holier than thou attitude about an activity that exists for 90% of its practitioners only to make them happy just annoys me.

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Hmmm  ... interesting.

 

Here we have a very desired camera in the FUJI X PRO 1 and people want to change it. It makes me wonder why the PRO 1 was so desireable in the first place.

 

There are plenty of cameras in the market to choose from that have articulated screens. There is no need to come and screw up the one camera that appeals to to those of us that don't want a "transformer like" camera.

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you want purist, buy a film camera, thats purist. theres nothing complicated or 'in the way' about features one will not use--simply dont use them! what a thought! ive never ever shot a video, but i also have never prayed to the camera god that the next camera i bought didnt have it. what do i care if it does--i just dont use it. it is a feature of every cam ive bought, and never once did it 'get in my way'. dont even know its there. you dont want an articulating screen? make believe you dont have one! i have one on my rd1 and it never 'gets in my way' because i never use it!

 

for others these non purist features are actually tools thst they do in fact use. an articulating screen is a great aid in discreet shooting. but how does that possible use get in the way of one who doesnt use it? or video? or live view? you know whats not 'purist'? freaking auto focus! face recognition! auto metering! i shoot manual lenses 90% of the time, so i guess i should pray the xp2 doesnt have autofocus! how would the purists like that?

 

sorry for the rant, but this holier than thou attitude about an activity that exists for 90% of its practitioners only to make them happy just annoys me.

 

Take a breath why don't you.  Your first post and this is it?  Nice...

 

Folks are taking Tom way too literally in my opinion... He's saying keep it the pure shooters camera it is now.  Don't bog it down with a bunch of crap the majority in this market don't use.  Tom didn't say strip the camera of any features it already has, just improve what it does have.  Beef up the pixels, and the processor it will still be a coveted camera.  Add in a few features like dual card slots and hybrid VF and you have a very desirable upgrade that just takes something that was great to begin with, and makes it even greater.

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          I think the X-Pro2 will probably be pretty "purist" (as even the X-T1 is - no X camera is a still/video hybrid, and you can shoot an X-T1 all day long using the menu only to format cards), by modern digital standards - very likely simpler than the X-T1 (no articulated screen, maybe no (or less emphasis on) Wi-Fi). We aren't going to see a fancy video mode, although it may well keep Fuji's "afterthought" video from the rest of the X series.

     Losing live view completely, however, means losing any form of manual focus other than scale focusing, and losing any way of controlling autofocus - it becomes AF-only, and center focus only (at most, it could have a spot/wide switch). Of course, purists would say "put in a true rangefinder". Fuji last did that in some of the earlier Texas Leicas (the electronic "rangefinder" in the X-Pro1 and X100 series depends on Live View). The later 645 Texas Leicas were actually center autofocus instead of rangefinders - they were 645 versions of 35mm compacts. Some of the earlier 645s and the larger formats WERE rangefinders, but they had either fixed lenses or very limited lens selections.

        The X-series lens range already includes quite a few lenses that would be no fun at all on a rangefinder (note that the classic Leica lens range only reached from 28 to 90mm, with some relatively rare wider lenses using auxiliary viewfinders and a slow 135 that was a bear to focus or compose with). On APS-C, that means 18 to 60 (or so), with anything wider using an auxiliary finder, and longer or very fast lenses just not working well (the 90 is a possibility, but not an easy lens to use). Both the X-series 56 and the 90 are actually too fast for a rangefinder - Leica's 90 is f2, much easier to focus than a 56 f1.2 with a similar field of view on APS-C, and the Leica 135 that is equivalent to the Fuji 90 is actually a f3.4 lens, 1.5 stops slower than the Fuji.  The way Leica gets away with the Noctilux is that it's a midrange focal length, plus it's very hard to focus.

    I could (maybe) see Fuji releasing a very low volume model at some point that accepted these limitations and WAS a rangefinder, without even a rear screen. Kind of like the special edition Leica M that is floating around with an ISO dial on the back instead of the screen (yes, it's digital, although it has no menus and no image review). I REALLY hope the X-Pro2 is NOT that camera - I like my 50-140 and 10-24! I hope the X-Pro2 is an X-series flagship, somewhat purist but a part of the system, rather than a special model for street photographers that uses three or four lenses!

          On the other hand, Fuji has worked with Cosina (Bessa rangefinders and the recent "Zeiss Ikon") in the past, and it might not be that much work to combine some X-Pro and Bessa parts to make a cult camera!  If it had X-Pro heritage, it could use enough electronics to do zooming frame lines and the like, and to have far better viewfinder displays than any Leica. It would be likely to contain an X-Pro 2 board, but with some connectors not attached - I'm sure the screenless Leica actually has the electronics to drive the omitted screen... If they do that, one possibility is to keep a version of the hybrid VF, maybe with certain overlays but without EVF mode (meaning it actually HAS Live View, but is only using it in a limited way), allowing movable autofocus points and an electronic rangefinder.

 

       If I were Fuji, I'd do the line as follows (in order of release date). I actually think this is more or less in order of potential sales volume (although the X-T2 may outsell the X-Pro 2, and the X-Pro 3 at the very end will be a big seller) - I think the rangefinder will sell less than medium format  (Leicas sell in the medium format range, especially when you exclude collector sales, and the Leica special model with no screen was a run of 100 or so).

 

From January to maybe 3-4 years from now  (and omitting X-E and lower end cameras for clarity's sake):

X-Pro 2 (hybrid VF or VERY good EVF, new 24+ MP sensor, X-T1 AF or better, X-Pro1 shape (side finder), weather sealed)

X-T2 (EVF only, SLR shape, X-Pro 2 sensor, new video mode that is not an afterthought (?), a few new features (GPS?), improved Wi-Fi)

GX-Pro 1 (medium format 50+ MP, release with three primes and a zoom)

X-R1? (rangefinder (traditional or electronic) purist model that uses certain X lenses, but don't even think about the 100-400 or some others, perhaps no rear screen at all)... Release with updated versions of the 18 and 60 (not 56 - it's too fast unless it's an electronic rangefinder), and possibly a couple of other midrange lens updates meant to work well with this body.

X-Pro 3 (organic sensor).

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The opposite of pure—reducing a state of the art digital camera to the limitations of a film camera. Purism with a digital camera implements the state of the art features available at the time of manufacture in my opinion. A stripped down digital camera is simply a crippled camera that would require constant workarounds to overcome its limitations. That is totally contrary to the spirit of digital photography.

 

Stripped down? I would prefer to say 'less loaded'. I just want to copy the picture of the object from my mind to the sd-card. HD movies capabilities don't help me. Same with wifi. And I'm an old man, used to look through an OVF. So even a tilt screen and live view are useless for me. These are my personal wishes. What's wrong?

The T2 will have all these features. Why should Fuji produce two identical cameras?   

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Stripped down? I would prefer to say 'less loaded'. I just want to copy the picture of the object from my mind to the sd-card. HD movies capabilities don't help me. Same with wifi. And I'm an old man, used to look through an OVF. So even a tilt screen and live view are useless for me. These are my personal wishes. What's wrong?

The T2 will have all these features. Why should Fuji produce two identical cameras?   

 

 

If it is about photography give me the richest and most advanced toolset I can use. If I don't need a feature at the moment, next week it may let me overcome a rare and difficult photographic situation, and because I truly understand my cameras, could be my photograph of a lifetime. 

 

If it is about cameras, by all means go for Leica. Every time they remove a contemporary feature, they add $1,000US to the price and the suckers buy it. Why? Because it is ridiculously expensive, and Leica has mastered selling mystique. The same people who buy Leica, show up at exclusive car auctions with a 2005 Ferrari Superamerica with less than 1,000 km on the odometer, because they need the garage space for the Bugatti that is on order. They won't drive the Bug any more than the Ferarri. Connoisseurs of stuff bought as objects to hopefully raise their personal self-image.

 

As an aside, the first camera an employer put in my hands was a Leica IIIg and I still have my battered M3. However, at that time, they were tools for working photographers, not chest jewelry for dilettantes and wealthy collectors. 

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